Posts Tagged ‘the Quran’

“There is no violent verse in Quran if a verse is seen with the verses in the context”

March 16, 2014

http://thesuperstitiousnakedape.wordpress.com/2014/03/10/the-omnimalevolent-creator-and-the-problem-of-good/comment-page-1/#comment-13168

PAARSURREY says:
March 16, 2014 at 9:11 pm

@BOBBIERILEYJR: March 15, 2014 at 6:05 pm

Your words:
“114 chapters in the Quran, 86-90 are classified as Meccan” Unquote

Paarsurrey replies:

Quran does not classify the verses or the chapters to be Meccans or Medinian .

This has perhaps been done later on the basis of Hadith, which never existed in the time of Muhammad and was collected 250/300 years after Muhammad, or by guesswork; and therefore has no relevance with our present discussion.

A particular verse and the verses in the context quite clarify the situation at hand; hence no need of any such classification.

Quran is the first and the foremost source of guidance of Islam/Muhammad for the Muslims whatever the denomination.
I don’t debate with anybody to win; I only discuss.

Our present discussion will remain focused on the topic “There is no violent verse in Quran if a verse is seen with the verses in the context”.

That is where our discussion began. I will ignore all other things that our friend bobbierileyjr mentions, please.
The discussion is open for everybody of any religion or no-religion, no bar from me.

No list is to be discussed; one verse at a time with the verses in the context. We can discuss verse by verse, as many verses as our friends may want to.

http://thesuperstitiousnakedape.wordpress.com/2014/03/10/the-omnimalevolent-creator-and-the-problem-of-good/comment-page-1/#comment-13309

PAARSURREY says:
March 18, 2014 at 10:25 pm

@BOBBIERILEYJR says: ;March 16, 2014 at 10:06 pm
Quote “And why would you leave out Sura 5:38
“[As for] the thief, the male and the female, amputate their hands in recompense for what they committed as a deterrent [punishment] from Allah . And Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise.” Unquote

Paarsurrey replies:

This verse was not missed; it was given in my post of March 16, 2014 at 9:16 pm; it was numbered [5:39] , and read “And as for the man who steals and the woman who steals, cut off their hands in retribution of their offence as an exemplary punishment from Allah. And Allah is Mighty, Wise.”

THE MISSING VERSE WAS:

“[5:38] They will wish to come out of the Fire, but they will not be able to come out of it, and they shall have a lasting punishment.”

Later the mistake was rectified with these words:

“I have made the necessary correction on my blog where I quoted the verses; you may check it there, please.

There is no edit button here for correction.”

Sorry for the inconvenience.

This is just to straighten the record.

The arrangement of the chapters and verses of Quran

March 15, 2014

http://thesuperstitiousnakedape.wordpress.com/2014/03/10/the-omnimalevolent-creator-and-the-problem-of-good/comment-page-1/#comment-13138
https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2014/03/02/it-is-up-to-the-atheists-they-all-may-join-in-to-prove-violence-in-quran-verse-by-verse-from-the-context/#comment-4337

BOBBIERILEYJR says:
March 15, 2014 at 3:13 am

First, do you acknowledge the 114 suras of the Quran are not listed in the chronological order in which Mohammad recited them?

PAARSURREY says:
March 15, 2014 at 5:07 pm

@BOBBIERILEYJR says:March 15, 2014 at 3:13 am
“First, do you acknowledge the 114 suras of the Quran are not listed in the chronological order in which Mohammad recited them?”

Yes; the verses were revealed for guidance of the prophet and his followers according to the situation on hand but the prophet was told to put the verses on the place where it was to be read/kept in the permanent arrangement; and those who committed it to memory and as also to the scribes; and everybody did accordingly.

This shows that Quran is a practical guidance for the situation in hand for the believers of that time as also with the context verses in the permanent arrangement for all the situations in all times to come in future.
It might be important to you; but not at all important to us the believers.

Quran as it is today; was recited by Muhammad; and there never existed two different Quran with two different texts; neither in the time of Muhammad nor thereafter.

It is for this that all verses of Quran become crystal clear from the verses in the context and there is no ambiguity left.

For details, please read the relative place in the following chapter:
“THE COMPILATION OF THE QURAN”
Page 354-368
“Introduction to the study of Holy Quran”
By Hazrat Mirza Bashiruddin Mahmood Ahmad s/o Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad 1835-1908 the Promised Messiah

http://www.alislam.org/library/books/Introduction-Study-Holy-Quran.pdf

Violence is in the minds and hearts of the Atheists not in Quran

March 10, 2014

The viewers could see my comments on the following blog for their valuable comments:

“Dwindling In Unbelief”
“Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?”

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.ca/2006/06/which-is-more-violent-bible-or-quran.html
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=26149572&postID=114987521408797161&page=2&token=1394482133017

paarsurrey said:

@Richard : Thu Mar 06, 03:31:00 PM 2014, Thu Mar 06, 04:11:00 PM 2014,

You said:
“What I posted as 4:89 may have been some sort of cut and paste error” Unquote.

You know that there was no copy/paste error; as there is no such item on the page you took the verses from. It seems to be a deliberate attempt to change the text of the verse of Quran.

Other stuff you gave in your posts, referenced above, as a cover up of your wrong doing are off-topic and not worthy of any attention. The topic is specific about Quran (“Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?”) so please only quote Quran or get the topic amended.

If you have nothing substantial to write in connection with the verse in discussion Quran; you may select another verse from the 527 violent verses you mentioned in the original post.

If you cannot prove a single violent verse in Quran and have to resort to changing the text to prove your viewpoint then it is obvious the violence is in the minds and hearts of the Atheists not in Quran.

Better quote another verse from another place of Quran for discussion and try your luck in vain.
Mon Mar 10, 01:08:00 PM 2014

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=26149572&postID=114987521408797161&page=2&token=1394488106581

paarsurrey said:

@Richard said: Mon Mar 10, 01:55:00 PM 2014, Mon Mar 10, 02:00:00 PM 2014

You wrote:
“(Where did you get 527 from?)”

Please see the OP (The Original Post of this blog) titled:

Quote: “Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?”

(Repost with updated numbers and graphs on 2 April 2011)

The LORD is a man of war. Exodus 15:3

Fight in the way of Allah. Quran 2:244

Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran? Is there a way to objectively answer such a question?

Well, it wouldn’t be easy. But it is possible to compare the amount of cruelty and violence in the two books.

Here is a summary of the highlighted verses in the SAB and SAQ.

Number of Cruel or Violent Passages

Bible 1214

Quran 527 ” Unquote

Please access the following link to see it.

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.ca/2006/06/which-is-more-violent-bible-or-quran.html

The rest of the contents of your posts, referred by me in the beginning, are off-topic and or not on the topic; so I won’t discuss them.

If you are defending the OP; then quote another of the alleged 527 verses that show violence in Quran.

I will discuss the topic verse by verse not in general.

Mon Mar 10, 02:48:00 PM 2014

It is up to the atheists; they all may join in to prove violence in Quran, verse by verse, from the context

March 2, 2014

Please view Paarsurrey’s comments on the following blog for your valuable opinion:

“Dwindling In Unbelief”
“Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?”
http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.ca/
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogid=26149572&postid=114987521408797161&page=2&token=1393790601994

paarsurrey said…

@Richard said:Sun Mar 02, 11:01:00 AM 2014

“You should also note the effort by paarsurrey to say the Quran was taken out of context.”Unquote

I still maintain that; since we are not in a formal debate; when you started being off-topic and shifted to Hadith and hearsay; I withdrew from the discussion temporarily.

If you can keep yourself restrained to Quran and its context; you will see me back in the discussion again.

Now it is up to the atheists; they all may join in.
Sun Mar 02, 12:03:00 PM 2014

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogid=26149572&postid=114987521408797161&page=2&token=1393790601994

Atheists! common sense approach to understand Quran verse/s

February 20, 2014

I wrote following comments: blog name “Dwindling In Unbelief”: topic “”Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?”: link:
http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.ca/2006/06/which-is-more-violent-bible-or-quran.html

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=26149572&postID=114987521408797161&page=2&token=1392928722501

paarsurrey said
@Richard : Sun Feb 09, 04:19:00 PM 2014

“So I check parts of the Quran and sometimes consider comments by Imams in countries that are 90+ % Islam. Yes… I consider translations of imams speaking to Arabic Al Jazeera. Beat your wife soon, she might need it!” Unquote.

This shows that your approach is wrong. These sources which you quote have no status in Islam. Quran itself is self-explanatory. Quran does not delegate any authority to these people.

The correct approach for one, if one wanted to do some research and intended to read its chapter two; then to start with one should have studied the entire chapter two on one’s own. One should have prepared notes while reading, if a question would have naturally arisen from a verse and its context verses; one should have written that question in the note book. If the subsequent verses in the chapter would have cleared the question, one should have noted this also. After the end if there would have been a question which would have not resolved, then one should have again read the chapter and perused it intensively to form an opinion. Afterwards one could discuss such question for clarification. Else it just amounts to hearsay.

One of my atheist friends suggested me reading a book by Christopher Hitchens; I first read the book twice and then started discussing the issues.

If you did not adopt a right approach previously; you can try it now; no harm.

Please have confidence instead of relying on false opinions.

Thanks
Tue Feb 11, 12:41:00 PM 2014

paarsurrey said…
@Richard : Tue Feb 11, 06:28:00 PM 2014

“There is no specific way of checking which is true”

Please don’t be angry and confused.

I think it is not difficult to understand the verses by using a common sense approach which is generally helpful for understanding any book in the world.

A single verse without the text and the context could be sometimes misleading.

One cannot correctly understand the meaning of a word unless one knows the whole sentence in which it has been used; the value of a sentence could be best understood in a passage, and of a passage is best understood in a chapter. The reference with the context is therefore most essential for a useful discussion.

This helps to understand the verses; hence Quran is self-explanatory.

Please try it for correct understanding; no harm.

Will you please?

Thanks

Wed Feb 12, 01:58:00 PM 2014

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=26149572&postID=114987521408797161&page=2&token=1392928722501

paarsurrey said…
@Richard : Sun Feb 09, 04:19:00 PM 2014, Tue Feb 11, 06:28:00 PM 2014

The topic of the post is “Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?” so for all fairness we should confine to the discussion on Quran from the Quranic adjacent verses; or the immediate context.

If you don’t accept this then please change the topic of the post accordingly; it only mentions of Bible and Quran and nothing else, in my opinion.

Please

https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/
Thu Feb 20, 12:38:00 PM 201

Muslims, Jews, Christians and others can benefit from the use of word “Allah”

February 13, 2014

My comments on blog “Leading Malaysian Neocon”: topic “Do Islam and the Quran Have Typological Connections to the Old Testament?”;Link :

http://scottthong.wordpress.com/

http://scottthong.wordpress.com/2013/06/17/do-islam-and-the-quran-have-typological-connections-to-the-old-testament/#comment-521080

paarsurrey Says:
February 14, 14 at 6:26 am
@Ron :October 16, 13 at 4:27 am
@Scott Thong :October 16, 13 at 11:12 am

The word Allah was used by the infidels (the Meccans) even before the advent of Islam/Quran/Muhammad.

The decision needs to be revisited as Quran clearly permits for the Believers, the Jews, the Christians and the Sabians to believe in Allah:

[2:63] Surely, the Believers, and the Jews, and the Christians and the Sabians — whichever party from among these truly believes in Allah and the Last Day and does good deeds — shall have their reward with their Lord, and no fear shall come upon them, nor shall they grieve.

http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?ch=2&verse=62

This restriction is counter-productive; how could one propagate Islam if the Jews, the Christians and others cannot use this word Allah- the sign of ONENESS of all the attributes of One-True-God?

This is the first tenet of Islam and Islam is for everybody under the globe.

How to study Quran? An advice to Atheists

February 11, 2014

I wrote following comments; blog “Dwindling In Unbelief”; topic:”Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?”; link:

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.ca/2006/06/which-is-more-violent-bible-or-quran.html

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=26149572&postID=114987521408797161&page=2&token=1392151301779

paarsurrey said…:
@Richard said…: Sun Feb 09, 04:19:00 PM 2014

“So I check parts of the Quran and sometimes consider comments by Imams in countries that are 90+ % Islam. Yes… I consider translations of imams speaking to Arabic Al Jazeera. Beat your wife soon, she might need it!” Unquote.

This shows that your approach is wrong. These sources which you quote have no status in Islam. Quran itself is self-explanatory. Quran does not delegate any authority to these people.

The correct approach for one, if one wanted to do some research and intended to read its chapter two; then to start with one should have studied the entire chapter two on one’s own. One should have prepared notes while reading, if a question would have naturally arisen from a verse and its context verses; one should have written that question in the note book. If the subsequent verses in the chapter would have cleared the question, one should have noted this also. After the end if there would have been a question which would have not resolved, then one should have again read the chapter and perused it intensively to form an opinion. Afterwards one could discuss such question for clarification. Else it just amounts to hearsay.

One of my atheist friends suggested me reading a book by Christopher Hitchens; I first read the book twice and then started discussing the issues.

If you did not adopt a right approach previously; you can try it now; no harm.

Please have confidence instead of relying on false opinions.

Thanks

Tue Feb 11, 12:41:00 PM 2014

paarsurrey said…
@Richard : Tue Feb 11, 06:28:00 PM 2014

“There is no specific way of checking which is true”

Please don’t be angry and confused.

I think it is not difficult to understand the verses by using a common sense approach which is generally helpful for understanding any book in the world.

A single verse without the text and the context could be sometimes misleading.

One cannot correctly understand the meaning of a word unless one knows the whole sentence in which it has been used; the value of a sentence could be best understood in a passage, and of a passage is best understood in a chapter. The reference with the context is therefore most essential for a useful discussion.

This helps to understand the verses; hence Quran is self-explanatory.

Please try it for correct understanding; no harm.

Will you please?

Thanks
Wed Feb 12, 01:58:00 PM 2014
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=26149572&postID=114987521408797161&page=2&token=1392242318327

“Pope Francis: Islam and the Quran are opposed to every form of violence”2

February 11, 2014

I wrote comments on the blog “Dwindling In Unbelief” on the topic “Pope Francis: Islam and the Quran are opposed to every form of violence”; that could be viewed by clicking the following links:

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.ca/2013/11/pope-francis-islam-and-quran-are.html
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=26149572&postID=8462729359203047845&page=1&token=1392133311657

paarsurrey said…
@Steve Wells : Mon Feb 10, 03:39:00 PM 2014

Thank you for informing me that you live in the USA. It is a good state to live in; and many of my kith and kin live there and enjoy life there.

Please again peruse the verses of Quran I have quoted; you may read as many verses before them and after them as you like; you will realize that the verses don’t discuss anybody’s conversion to Islam by force; this is not all the subject matter of the verses.

Quran is for ethical, moral and spiritual up-lift of the human beings; it has got nothing to do with ruling any territory/ies and grabbing power.

The verses are general for everybody Muslim or non-Muslim. A Muslim who is cruel and jealous of others and persecutes others for the bounties others have got; he is as fit to receive the punishment and wrath of the One-True-God as those who don’t believe in Islam. This is exactly mentioned in the verses. In fact terrorism and its punishment is discussed in them, not literally but in so many words.

It is for this that I wrote you “to prove that the teachings mentioned in the verses are against the norms of the society and are violent”.

Thanks for joining the discussion; others could also join the discussion if they don’t agree with me.

After all it is a friendly discussion.

Tue Feb 11, 07:41:00 AM 2014

paarsurrey said…
@ Steve Wells : Tue Feb 11, 09:50:00 AM 2014

Regarding Cutting of leg Please read the following:

Leg Amputation

When you have a blockage or narrowing of the arteries supplying your legs, the circulation to your legs is reduced. You may have developed pain in your foot or feet waking you at night, ulceration, or black areas on your toes, feet or leg.
If severe arterial disease is left untreated, the lack of blood circulation will cause the pain to increase. Tissue in the leg will die due to lack of oxygen and nutrients, which leads to infection and gangrene. In some cases, gangrene can be very dangerous as the infection can spread through the body and become life-threatening.
Amputation is always a last resort and will only be recommended if your surgeon has decided it is not possible to improve the circulation in any other way.
The main sites of amputation are;
• Just below the knee
• Through the knee
• Through the thigh
The site of amputation will depend on how poor the blood supply to your leg is. If possible, below knee amputations are performed, as it is easier to walk with an artificial limb after the operation. However, many people do well after a thigh amputation. The following information will help to explain the procedure of leg amputation:

http://www.circulationfoundation.org.uk/help-advice/peripheral-arterial-disease/leg-amputation/

Do you think the Doctor who operates and cuts off a leg infected by gangrene; he does a cruel act?

Wed Feb 12, 01:26:00 PM 2014

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