Posts Tagged ‘Socrates’

All revealed religions have same basic teachings

April 29, 2012

All the revealed religions had the same basic teachings and were truthful in their origin. Religions presented by Buddha, Krishna, Zoroaster, Socrates, Moses, Cyrus, Jesus etc were all truthful in origin; which proves that they had the same one source of Revelation from the ONE-Creator God.

Religion brought civilization

November 25, 2011

There took place an interesting discussion on the above topic, initiated by me, on my favorite discussion forum, the hubpages.

I have omitted some of the posts which were not directly related to the issue of the topic and which don’t add any meaning to the discussion at hand; the conversation is given hereunder for the viewers of this blog with courtesy of hubpages.

I, however, respect and love all the posters on the hubpages.

One may access the following link to see the whole of it.

http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/86167

OP from Paarsurrey

Religion brought civilization

Gobekli Tepe proves it.

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2011/06/gobekli-tepe/mann-text

1. A Troubled Man

And once again, we see that you have failed at one or both of these:

1. Read the article
2. Comprehended the article

“What it suggests, at least to the archaeologists working there, is that the human sense of the sacred—and the human love of a good spectacle—may have given rise to civilization itself.”

2. autumn18

The article doesn’t prove anything. It shows that some of the worlds archaeologists are still researching the beginning of civilization.

3. Paarsurrey

“The Birth of Religion
We used to think agriculture gave rise to cities and later to writing, art, and religion. Now the world’s oldest temple suggests the urge to worship sparked civilization.”

The article does hint clearly that farming and civilization started 12000 years ago with religion; it did not start with atheism.

4. A Troubled Man posted

Funny guy, you’ll say anything to prop up your beliefs. You post links that actually DO NOT support what you claim and what you believe.

5. Psycheskinner

The same argument could probably be made for the fermenting of alcohol.

6. A Troubled Man

+1

7. SimeyC

No argument there: alcohol = civilization.

Even God knew this – there was a Eleventh Commandment that was accidently broken:
Though shalt all consume alcohol

Why do you think Jesus turned water into wine?

OK so there goes my chance of getting into heaven!!!!

8. Disappearinghead

God gave us beer because He wanted us to be happy.

9. Emile R

Fascinating article paar. Thanks for sharing the link.

10. Paarsurrey

Yet the atheists won’t accept it; once they have decided psychologically to doubt everything, they cannot come out of this wrong state. Their thinking is neither natural nor reasonable.

Thanks for your appreciation.

11. Wilderness

“Wrong state”. Yet it behooves us to doubt everything we hear – the vast majority of “information” we receive is not factual.

Far better to doubt and look for truth than to simply believe everything we hear because it fits with what we want to be true. It is a concept you would be well advised to understand better.

12. Paarsurrey

One should doubt only where it is reasonable to doubt; not otherwise; then it will become a psychological disease.

Science does not support your viewpoint; it supports only where it is reasonable to doubt.

13. Wilderness

Wrong again, Paar. You have immersed yourself so thoroughly in the world of theology that you haven’t the faintest idea of how science works or what it does.

Science always doubts; only after thousands or tens of thousands of tests is something beyond doubt, and even then only in those particular circumstances of the tests.

Theology on the other hand will declare there is no reasonable doubt after deciding something is true; tests aren’t necessary, only rationalization that leads to the predetermined conclusion. There is thus always serious doubt by scientific methodology but theology doesn’t recognize that methodology so the truth stands.

You truly need to try, and try hard, to understand this concept. Science doesn’t accept theological methodology as useful any more than theology accepts science methodology as required. You continue to use religious methods of finding truth and expect science to agree, but it doesn’t work that way.

14. Paarsurrey

Science only will deal where there is a reasonable ground to doubt; if they observe some anomaly then they would doubt; otherwise they need not.

15. Emile R

Let me clarify. The article doesn’t support your OP. It doesn’t mean it wasn’t fascinating though. Did you notice they haven’t excavated anymore than a portion of one tenth of the site? And that there could be monuments even deeper, going further back in history?

Amazing discoveries could still be ahead.

16. Paarsurrey

I agree with you.

17. A Troubled Man

Really? Or, is it such that you never read the article or you didn’t comprehend it and now you’re trying to back peddle because the article does not support your silly claims?

Funny how the more you post, the more we can see what your religion has actually taught you.

18. Psycheskinner

This morning the sun rose to the sound of geese honking. So clearly geese cause the sun to rise.

19. Wilderness posted

Just so. Religion may well have risen alongside civilization; as more and more people live in close contact it is inevitable that someone will invent and use religion to control the others. Also, any new thought about understanding the world around us (there is a god throwing lightning bolts and causing thunder) spreads quickly with lots of people around.

There is, however, no indication that religion caused the rise of civilization. It is convenient to think so as it gives a usefulness to religion that isn’t there, and you will find lots of people that will believe it because, just like your geese, the time element works.

On the whole, though, religion retards the progression of civilization. Religion almost always denies new knowledge and will always try to maintain the status quo as that’s what keeps it in power – this is not bringing civilization.

20. Couturepopcafe

I believe you are right, wilderness. Ancient Greece was civilized beyond belief well before the advent of organized religion. They dressed elegantly in draped garments designating their status in the community, women wore ‘gym’ clothes to participate in spartan athletic games of skill, and men debated world views and allowed the opinions of women equal weight.

21. Paarsurrey

I don’t agree with you.

Socrates, a cream of them, himself was a messenger prophet of the Creator God.

22. A Troubled Man

“Taqiyya, meaning religious dissimulation, is a practice emphasized in Shi’a Islam whereby adherents may conceal their religion when they are under threat, persecution, or compulsion. This means a legal dispensation whereby a believing individual can deny his faith or commit otherwise illegal or blasphemous acts while they are under those risks.”

Someone is certainly taking advantage of this immoral and unethical Islamic teaching.

23. Paarsurrey

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim; and the posters here know very well that I don’t conceal that.

24. A Troubled Man

And, like all other Muslims, you will use Taqiyaa when it suits your purposes, as you have done here countless times.

25. Couturepopcafe

paars – do you really think so? Socrates was an existentialist, believing we should think for ourselves, examine every bit of authority and worldview. He believed in perfecting ones soul but is never said to have been a devotee of one god. That doesn’t mean he discounted the existence of god as a collective consciousness.

You may be correct in that sense. As a messenger, or person who lived at a higher level of awareness, he was trying to tell us that we should examine our own thinking, purpose, and awareness and not be cattled by conventional thinking.

26. Paarsurrey

Please quote Socrates’ words to support your view point.

27. Paarsurrey

To return to the topic of the thread “Religion brought civilization” I quote from the article about “Göbekli Tepe”:

“ Most of the world’s great religious centers, past and present, have been destinations for pilgrimages—think of the Vatican, Mecca, Jerusalem, Bodh Gaya (where Buddha was enlightened), or Cahokia (the enormous Native American complex near St. Louis). They are monuments for spiritual travelers, who often came great distances, to gawk at and be stirred by. Göbekli Tepe may be the first of all of them, the beginning of a pattern. What it suggests, at least to the archaeologists working there, is that the human sense of the sacred—and the human love of a good spectacle—may have given rise to civilization itself.”

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2011/06/gobekli-tepe/mann-text

28. A Troubled Man

That’s exactly the same quote I provided to you showing that your claim in the OP is nonsense. Now, you use the very same quote to support your claim? Just how dishonest are you going to get?

OOO
Hubpages is a good discussion site; one could comment there or here in this blog; comments are most welcome.

http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/86167

The world has become like a close-net village

November 28, 2009

The world has become like a close-net village
http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4253&p=82713#p82713

Hello Paar, I understand your love of Jesus, Mary and Moses. However, about Krishna, Buddha, Zoroaster and Cyrus, are you sure you are not violating the Quranic injunction?

Buddha particularly was an agnostic or a Deist who never really discussed about divinity and supernatural in his teaching. Maybe your answer will be that these people were originally prophets but their teachings interpolated over time period. Right?

How about Confucius? Do you love him too?

Humanity is but one family.

Paarsurrey wrote:

Hi friends.

Since Quran is a Word of Revelation from the All-Wise, the Creator- God Allah YHWH; He sent Messenger Prophets to all the lands of the world to guide the humanity to His path. Now that the world has become like a close-net village; all these Messengers Prophets have been honored by Muhammad. The truthful Revelations, deeds/acts of all these Messengers Prophets have been secured in Quran; and their role has been set by God to introduce their nations and lead them to Muhammad – the Seal of Messengers Prophets; Muhammad authenticates their truthfulness, under lasting principles mentioned in Quran.

I love Jesus, Mary, Moses, Moses’ mother, Krishna, Buddha, Lao Tse , Confucius, Socrates, Zoroaster, Cyrus etc great leaders of the world in Ethics, Morals and Spirituality; I love them all; this is the teaching of Quran/Islam/Muhammad as explained by the Promised Messiah 1835-1908. I think it has got a lot of common sense and wisdom; my Atheist and Agnostic friends would admit.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Is Islam the true religion of GOD?

September 25, 2009

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=4182

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friend Ani

Yes, Islam is the true religion of God; but that does not ‎mean that other revealed religion were not truthful. God ‎Allah YHWH sent the warners or Messengers Prophets to all ‎nations of the world for guidance; this is very much ‎mentioned in Quran, in my opinion. Quran is not a book of ‎names, so Quran has not mentioned them by names; so we can ‎deduce from that that Krishna,Buddha,Zoroaster, Socrates, ‎Moses,Jesus etc were all perfect men sent by God Allah YHWH ‎for guidance of human beings. They were the truthful ‎persons; and so were their Revelations truthful in origin.‎

All human beings are just like a family; every one of them ‎is to be loved and noone to be hated.‎

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

‎“Paarsurrey, Paarsurrey, Paarsurrey,” CCNL1‎L

September 18, 2009

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/2009/09/public_anger_and_belligerence/comments.html

Hi friend CCNLI and others

Quran is the first and the foremost source of Islam/Muhammad. Please give a reference from Quran, ‎quoting its text and context, if you want to discuss/criticise anything of Quran/Islam/Muhammad.

I accept all the Messengers Prophets sent by the Creator to all the nations, regions and religions of the ‎world. This establishes respect of every nation; and is the most humanist features of ‎Quran/Islam/Muhammad. Krishna, Buddah, Zoroaster, Moses, Jesus, Socratese, Muhammad etc are all ‎truthful Messengers Prophets sent by the Creator God (God Allah YHWH). The revelations sent to all these ‎Messenger Prophets were truthful in origin, and their teachings in essence have been preserved and ‎protected in Quran.

I love Jesus and Mary

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Paul8bee: Would you please explain significance and rationality of followings concepts of friend Ron Ash, an Agnostic

June 8, 2009

Paarsurrey says:

I have received following e-mails from our friend Ron Ash of: disciplesofloveministries.weebly.com
I understand that Atheists, Agnostics and Not-Theists are intelligent persons and since they don’t believe in blind faith; and rightly so, one thinks they would present things in a scientific way.

Presently I know following denominations of those who don’t believe that there is a Creator of this world or Universe:

• Atheists
• Agnostics
• Not- Theists

If there is yet another denomination; I would appreciate if somebody please mentions it.

I love Buddha and Socrates, wise men from God Allah YHWH- the All-Wise

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

E-mails from Ron Ashs:

1. Ron Ash
“We are our souls and our spirits created in the image of God.” (Ron Ash)

2. Ron Ash

“The best hope for an Atheist is that heaven is just a dream and hell is but a nightmare.” (Ron Ash)

3. Ron Ash

“Often when we don’t get the answer we want it is, because we asked the wrong questions.” (Ron Ash)

Why can a tree not think? Does a tree have awareness? If not, why not?

June 7, 2009

Ron Ash, our Agnostic friend, says:

I Am that I Am

Paarsurrey sasy:

Hi friend Ron Ash

Please explain what you mean by these words “I Am that I Am”.

Are you in a doubt about yourself that you repeat “I am”, “I am” to assure yourself that you are very much alive?

Please express yourself fully.

paul8bee Says:

It is like this. If you have awareness, then that awareness is aware that you are aware. So Beware, Only a person who is self aware can think.

Can a tree think and respond, to the fact that it is a tree? I hope this helps.

I had a great day yesterday, just feeling things; no higher power there at all, just plain old feeling.

paarsurrey Says:

Hi friend paul8bee

Why can a tree not think? Does a tree have awareness? If not, why not?
Please make us wise with your wisdom.

Thanks

I love Buddha and Socrates; wise men from God Allah YHWH- the Most and All-Wise.

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Ron Ash- an Agnostic says : I Am that I Am

June 6, 2009

Ron Ash says:

I Am that I Am

Paarsurrey sasy:

Hi friend Ron Ash

Please explain what you mean by these words “I Am that I Am”.

Are you in a doubt about yourself that you repeat “I am”, “I am” to assure yourself that you are very much alive? Please express yourself fully.

I love Budda and Socrates; men of wisdom from God Allah YHWH who is All-Wise.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

All the revealed religions of the World unite under the banner of Muhammad, for temporal, moral and spiritual uplift of the human beings

June 3, 2009

maaark Says:

Please tell more about Ahmadi Muslims; why they different from others?
What do Muslims believe about the human condition? Does all mankind rebel against Allah? Are there some perfect humans?

https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/ask-paarsurrey/#comment-655

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friend maark

Welcome to ask a question.

With Mirza Ghulam Ahmad 1835-1908; all the Revealed Religions of the world stand revived. The Message of Krishna or Buddha in India; or Zoroaster in Persia; or Moses and Jesus in Judea or Socrates in Greece got diluted due to the passage of time.

The Message of God Allah YHWH has been the same; belief in ONENESS of God and following the Messenger sent by Him.

Almost all Revealed Religions of the world talk of the Second Coming of their religious hero or personage at the end of the days; that person is Mirza Ghulam Ahamd. He is Iman Mahdi, the Promised Messiah of the Muslims; Jesus’ Second Coming of the Christians; Krishna and Buddha’s Meitereyya etc.

He is a successor of Muhammad and follows the Quran; the last Word of God; which is inclusive of all the true teachings and act of all the Messengers Prophets of God.

This way all the revealed religions of the World unite under the banner of Muhammad, for temporal, moral and spiritual uplift of the human beings.

All Messengers of God Allah YHWH in any part of the world were innocent and perfect human beings; they were selected as a role model for their people.

I don’t think any one can really rebel against Allah; He rewards and punishes as per a set system of His attributes.

I think this answers your question in brief.

I love Jesus, Moses, Krishna, Buddha, Zoroaster and Socrates.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Second Coming 1835-1908 – to unite all Revealed Religions

March 7, 2009

http://disc.yourwebapps.com/discussion.cgi?id=148202;article=225065

Baruch says:

You (i.e., nm) are not the Mahdi; you can’t save Islam (nm)

Paarsurrey says:

Hi

The advent of Imam Mahdi 1835-1908, the Promised Messiah 1908, and Second Coming 1835-1908; all different titles of the one and the same person have taken place. He and his Successors are taking care of Islam. Peaceful Islam will save the world; the Traditional Islam or the Mullah Islam will slowly vanish away.

All Revealed Religions are truthful in origin; they will get united under the banner of Second Coming 1835-1908 with peaceful dialogue and no wars.

I love Buddha, Krishna, Moses, Zoroaster, Socrates and Jesus

Thanks