Posts Tagged ‘Paul’s animosity towards Jesus’

using force and fear by Christians to convert non-Christians

March 12, 2009

Originally Posted by sonoman:
using force and fear to convert non-Christians. Here where I live non-Christian Native Americans were butchered by Christians and all throughout North and South America, Australia, New Zealand, and Africa, Christians killed non-Christians and forced the remainder to stop their non-Christian religious practices.

Don’t be hypocritical towards Muslims when our Christian history is filled with so much violence against non-Christians and even fellow Christians. Muslims are very far behind us in death tally of non-Christians at the hands of Christian believers.

The problem is that men have used God for millennia as an object of warfare. All three Abrahamic religions have been prone to corruption through territorial battling for control of the populations. Judaism limits its “national” territorial agenda to the Holy Land while Pauline Christianity tried to convert the world as does Muhammad’s Islam with Islam making no bones about being a nationalistic religion out to control the world. No, the problem remains with men corrupting religion with their animal need to establish and control territory–Abrahamic use God as their Big Chief to force non-Abrahamic into line.

Christianity would be pure if Christians followed Jesus’ teachings instead of Paul’s but they don’t. They follow Paul’s gospel which includes commandment to Christians to obey their established governmental authorities Paul says were appointed by God and thus Christians obey their leaders leading them continually into war. From Constantine to the Popes to the European kings to the Manifest Destiny Protestants to George Bush’s war in Iraq we see Christians being told to go to war against non-Christians.

Paarsurrey says:

Hi

I have noted following points from your post.

1. Here where I live non-Christian Native Americans were butchered by Christians and all throughout North and South America, Australia, New Zealand, and Africa, Christians killed non-Christians and forced the remainder to stop their non-Christian religious practices.
2. Don’t be hypocritical towards Muslims when our Christian history is filled with so much violence against non-Christians and even fellow Christians. Muslims are very far behind us in death tally of non-Christians at the hands of Christian believers.
3. Christianity would be pure if Christians followed Jesus’ teachings instead of Paul’s but they don’t. They follow Paul’s gospel which includes commandment to Christians to obey their established governmental authorities Paul says were appointed by God and thus Christians obey their leaders leading them continually into war.

I think the Protestants would also note these points and would revise their tenets accordingly.

I love Jesus and would defend him against strange teaching of Paul, unknown to Jesus

Regards
__________________
paarsurrey – an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

P.S. I have added a page titled “Ask Paarsurrey” on my blog for the questions. Please view it on the side bar of my blog for peaceful questions and discussions. Everybody is welcome; even those who differ with me.
https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/

Baruch’s Conversion from a Christian to a Jew

August 7, 2008

Hi
I think it is only because the Christians follow mythical theological philosophy of Paul invented at Rome; and that they don’t follow simple teachings of Jesus that their faith is no longer rational and reasonable. The ordinary, man in the street, has not other alternative than either to become an Atheist/Agnostic or to change his religion. This is the frustration, in my opinion, of the most of the Christians of today.
I give hereunder a real story of Bruce James (Baruch Gershom) who converted from mythical Christianity of Paul to Judaism.
The Christians are requested to search for the real faith of Jesus by leaving deviant ways of Paul and returning to Jesus.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Courtesy: http://judaism.about.com/od/conversiontojudaism/a/baruch.htm

From Bruce James (Baruch Gershom) , for About.com

I wrote the following article which was published in the Baltimore Jewish Times on April 10, 1981. It has been excerpted in the book “Becoming Jewish” by Rabbi Maurice Lamm.

“You’re a convert? Gee. That’s interesting. If you don’t mind my asking, why did you do it?”

I suppose every convert to Judaism is asked the question and I’ve gotten used to it, but there is another comment I often hear that is disturbing:

“You’re a convert? There must have been a girl.”

Oy!

A lot of people just can’t believe that there is something in the Jewish religion worth having. Something that someone from the accepted, middle-class WASP world would want. So when a Jewish person makes this comment, I have to realize my patience and explain why I converted and how much value there is in being Jewish.

I doubt that my parents will ever understand why I converted. All they see now is a yarmulka on the head of a son who’s not the same person they watched grow up.

But I am the same person. Yes, I keep my head covered, pray three times a day, put on tefillin, keep a kosher home and stomach, keep Shabbos strictly, and observe other laws that, in my parents’ eyes, link me with the most fanatic and backward cult in the world. When I come home, it’s not as if their son came home, rather it’s as if they received a visit from someone from another planet.

Still, it is doubtful that I could have become an Orthodox Jew without important training I received at home.

My parents gave me a firm belief in G-d, a dedication to honesty and consistency, and a love for all people. Without these values I would have been lost in an agnostic world full of contradictions and ethical conflicts.

I was 16 when I decided to become a Jew. But even at 14 or 15 I was very religious, active in my church and giving thought to someday becoming a minister as had my great-great-grandfather. I was developing ideas that were different from standard Christian doctrine: not knowing any alternative, though, I decided to use them in a Christian context.

But all that changed one Friday night. My church confirmation class made a field trip to the synagogue in my hometown, Colorado Springs, Colorado. After the service, the rabbi stayed on and answered our questions.

One student asked if the color of the rabbi’s skullcap meant anything. No, he said. He has one to match his blue suit and others to match different articles of clothing. Another person asked him why they had somebody else (a cantor) sing the service. “Because he has a better voice than I have,” he answered quickly with a grin.

But I was cocky, and still believing that Jesus was Messiah, I baited the rabbi:

“Has the Messiah come yet?” I asked.

“No,” he said. “Look at all the suffering in the world.”

“When will he come?”

“Certainly not until we get better for him.”

“Then why should he come?”

“Exactly.”

I was stunned. Obviously, his answers to my questions were brief and over-simplified. But he hit me with one of my own theories that had no source in Christian doctrine: man plays a key role in the salvation of the world. The world is not doomed to destruction, and man may be, ultimately, perfectible.

I continued my studies of the New Testament. I was disturbed that the enlightenment of Jesus was fizzled by the narrow-minded doctrine of the Apostle Paul. Yet, when I finished my confirmation training, I was at the top of my class. On a test of Bible knowledge, the average score was 20 to 40 points. I scored an 88, double the next highest.

Then my minister asked everyone in my class to write a statement of faith. This would be used when the church elders considered our application for membership in the Presbyterian Church.

I prepared my paper with the same glee that Martin Luther must have had when he wrote his attack on the Catholic Church. First I attacked the way the Jewish ideas of Jesus had been cast away by Paul and other Church leaders and substituted with customs and values from pagan religions — often without benefit of any symbolic tie-in — all to make Christianity more marketable.

Then I attacked the dualism of Christianity. The devil got the blame for everything, I wrote with tongue in cheek, but where would Christianity be without the devil? What would motivate people to do good if not for the threat of eternal damnation?

One of the elders eventually read my piece. He told me that I had some interesting ideas. And he recommended me for membership. I couldn’t believe it. Didn’t the Church have any standards? I should have refused membership at that point. But at the time, I felt I really had no choice but to accept.

One day I just stopped going to church. But that didn’t send me to the synagogue. I didn’t know anything about Judaism. But I did know that I didn’t like the way Christianity had developed. In my mind, what had begun as a Jewish cult, in a short time, became a religion that preached love and fought wars.

The truth about Jesus’ resurrection from the dead

July 27, 2008

gavmbree Says:
July 24, 2008 at 9:14 pm

“4. If he didn’t really die and only passed out, then what happened years later if he eventually died? Why would Christianity have spread, if those that started it knew that it was a lie?
Also, the NT text clearly indicates throughout that Jesus really died and was really resurrected. My authority is the Old and New Testaments of The Holy Bible which is the Word of God.”

Paarsurrey Says:

Hi

Jesus got a new life after the tribulations faced by him on the Cross. By the grace of GodAllahYHWH he survived a cursed death on Cross. Without dying Jesus got a new life; this is a metaphoric usage, in my opinion, in all the language of the world. If one is sick with a deadly disease or faces a trauma in real life, when there is no hope for survival, it is commonly said that that person has got a new life. It is never taken as literal or physical life from the actually dead.

It is only a smartness of Paul or his cleverness that he made the humble Christians, simple minded sheep for centuries, to believe that Jesus had resurrected from the dead. He tried to make a mythical hero from the real Jesus. It was his attempt to win over the Christians by adding another feather to the hat of Jesus – whereas Jesus charisma needs nothing of the sort.

Even though I know that Jesus did not die a cursed death on Cross or he was not never resurrected from the dead; my love of Jesus and Mary is not lessened, since reality is always greater than the myth. Myth is only a fiction; isn’t it a reality?

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Promised Messiah 1835-1908 Says:

From the mere fact of Jesus not being in the tomb, can anybody in reason believe that he had gone up to heaven? May there not be other causes as a result of which tombs might remain empty. At the time of going up to heaven, it was up to Jesus to meet a few hundred Jews, and also Pilate. Whom was he afraid of in his glorious body. He did not care to furnish his opponents with the slightest proof. On the contrary, he took fright and fled to Galilee.

That is why we positively believe that though it is true that he left the tomb, a chamber with an opening, and though it is true that he secretly met the disciples, yet it is not true that he was given any new and glorious body; it was the same body, and the same wounds, and there was the same fear in his heart lest the accursed Jews arrest him again.

Just read attentively Matthew, chapter 28, verses 7 to 10. These verses clearly say that the women who were told by someone that Jesus was alive and was going to Galilee, and who were also told quietly that they should inform the disciples, were no doubt pleased to hear this, but they went with a terrified heart, — they were still afraid lest Jesus might still be caught by some wicked Jew.

The ninth verse says, that while these women were on their way to inform the disciples, Jesus met and saluted them. The tenth verse says that Jesus asked them not to be afraid, i.e. of his being caught; he asked them to inform his brethren that they should all go to Galilee; that they would see him there, i.e., he could not stay there for fear of the enemy.

In short, if Jesus had really come to life after his death and had assumed a glorious body, it was up to him to furnish proof of such life to the Jews. But we know that he did not do this. It is absurd, therefore, to accuse the Jews of trying to render negatory the proof of Jesus’ coming to life again. No, Jesus himself has not given the slightest proof of his restoration to life; rather, by his secret flight, by the fact of his taking food, and sleep, and exhibiting his wounds, he himself proved that he did not die on the Cross.
http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/ch1.html

I would humbly request all the searching souls to form their own truthful opinion and when fully satisfied they should accept the truth and support it.

Father Who Is In Heaven Listens To Jesus

July 23, 2008

Jesus said that father who is in heaven listens to him.

The Promised Messiah 1835-1908 commenting on this said:

The point in this is that God Almighty undoubtedly accepts prayers especially when His trustful servants, go to His door oppressed; He attends to their plaints, and helps them in strange ways. Of this I myself am a witness. Why is it then that the prayer of Jesus uttered in such agony was not accepted? No, it was accepted.

God saved him. God created circumstances on earth and in heaven to rescue him. John, the prophet Yahya, had had no time to pray, for his end had arrived, but Jesus had the whole night to pray, and he spent the whole night in prayer, standing and in prostration before God, for God had willed that he should give expression to his distress and should ask for his release from Him to Whom nothing was impossible. So the Lord, in accordance with His eternal practice, heard his prayer.

The Jews uttered a falsehood when, crucifying Jesus, they made the taunt that he relied upon God: why did not God save him? For God nullified all the designs of the Jews and saved His beloved Messiah from the Cross and the curse involved in it. The Jews had failed.

Among the testimonies of the gospel which have reached us is the verse from Matthew: ‘That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar. Verily I say unto you, all these things shall come upon this generation’.

Now, if you think over these verses you will find that Jesus (peace be on him) clearly states that the killing of prophets by the Jews ceased with the prophet Zacharias, and that after that, the Jews would have no power to kill any prophet. This is a great prophecy which clearly points out that Jesus (peace be on him) was not killed as the result of crucifixion; he was rather saved from the Cross, dying ultimately a natural death.

For if Jesus (peace be on him) was also to suffer death by murder like Zacharias, at the hands of the Jews, he would have hinted in these verses at his own murder. If it is urged that Jesus (peace be on him) also was killed by the Jews but his being killed was not a sin on the Jews’ part, for Jesus’ death was of the nature of an atonement, the contention is hardly tenable, for in John, chap. 19, verse 11, Jesus clearly says that the Jews have been guilty of a great sin for having resolved to kill Jesus; and likewise, in many other places there is the clear hint that as a penalty for the crime of which they had been guilty against Jesus, they had deserved punishment in the sight of God.

http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/ch1.html

Breathing difficulties of Jesus on Cross discussed

July 15, 2008

Stephen Bedard Says:
July 15, 2008 at 12:49 pm

The problem with that is that it is impossible to only seem dead during a crucifixion. In order to breathe, one must lift their body up. The way a person dies during crucifixion is that they are so exhausted they can no longer lift themselves up and they suffocate. So if Jesus passed out or even pretended to be dead, he would really be dead in just a few minutes.


paarsurrey
Says:
July 15, 2008 at 3:20 pm

Hi Stephen Bedard!
I respect your opinion but I can’t agree with you for reasons.
Jesus was not the only person put on Cross; there were two other persons mentioned in the NTBible, perhaps of more age than Jesus. They all suffered the same kind of treatment on the Cross. They had the same kind of difficulty of breathing if any on the Cross; yet they only died for sure when their legs were broken.
On a pretex Jesus’ legs were not broken, perhaps there was some sort of hidden collabration between the friends of Jesus, in my opinion, and the Pilate or the Roman officials. You know Pilate exclaimed with surprise that Jesus had died so soon.
I love Jesus and hence would love to see him survive against all odds. Paul was an enemy of Jesus so he invented a story at Rome that Jesus died a cursed or sinful death on Cross.
Jesus was then alive and in self-exile in India. Jesus did not die on Cross, he survived and died a peaceful and natural death in India, at some point in the history.

Please don’t mind; we are searching of truth.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful person

PromisedMessiah 1835-1908 Says:

Apart from this, it was necessary that he should escape death on the cross, for it was stated in the Holy Book that whoever was hanged on the wood was accursed. It is a cruel and an unjust blasphemy to attribute a curse to an eminent person like Jesus, the Messiah, for, according to the agreed view of all who know the language, la’nat, or curse, has reference to the state of one’s heart. A man would be said to be accursed when his heart, having been estranged from God, becomes really dark; when, deprived of divine mercy and of divine love, devoid absolutely of His Knowledge, blinded like the devil, he becomes filled with the poison of unbelief; when there remains not a ray of divine love and knowledge in him; when the bond of loyalty is broken, and between him and God there arises hatred and contempt and spite and hostility, so much so that God and he become mutual enemies; and when God becomes weary of him and he becomes weary of God; in short, when he becomes an heir to all the attributes of the Devil — and that is why the Devil himself is called accursed.
http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/ch1.html

Elijah was to descend from the heavens with his chariot before coming of Jesus

July 13, 2008

DT Says:
July 13, 2008 at 1:44 am

Admittedly I know very little of your particular brand of Islam, paarsurrey, but that doesn’t keep me from saying it is a false religion, for any sect led by a man called the Promised Messiah, who isn’t Jesus of Nazareth, goes against the Bible which I believe to be God’s Word. It seems that you, in typical Islamic fashion, pick and choose which scriptures of the Bible to believe. Would you say that anything that contradicts your assumptions, fo example the scriptures TJ pointed out speak of Christ’s literal death, are simply evidence of corruption? That’s the current mainstream Muslim apologetic approach. Perhaps yours is different.

Anyway, we appreciate this dialogue. As TJ said, perhaps we’ll post on this topic soon. Thank you.

paarsurrey Says:
July 13, 2008 at 10:19 am
Hi DT!
I appreciate your comments. You know that Jesus used to talk in parables; hence in my opinion those who wan to take his Second Coming as physical and literal don’t understand him and his person fully. Perhaps they are the ones who take things arbitrarily; especially the things he had himself explained.
Jews believed in the Second Coming of Elijah before advent of Jesus; and one should not forget that Jesus and Mary were Jews and the were followers of Moses. Elijaj was the person who went to skies alongwith his Chariot and horses to skies; the Jews believed in this. Jews waited for the descent of Elijah from the skies before Jesus’ arrival. They asked this question from Jesus and he replied that John the Baptist was the Elijah; of course not physically and literally, but metaphorically.

In this is the reply of Seond Coming of Jesus. I love Jesus and therefore I would side with Jesus instead of siding with Paul who wanted to take it physically and literally. Paul does not follow Jesus in the guidance Jesus provided in this connection. I don’t think the Christians are correct in believing such mythical concepts. This way they only become irrational whereas Jesus was a rational person.
This is my opinion; one may differ with it but with reasons.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim.

Jesus not an accursed person – a sinner as held by Paul

July 13, 2008

Job Says:

July 12, 2008 at 9:28 pm
Jesus Christ’s crucifixion has been independently verified by documents from the Roman Empire as well as the Jewish (NOT CHRISTIAN!) historian Flavius Josephus. Paul was not even in Jerusalem when Jesus Christ was crucified, and he may not have even been alive. The Bible narratives of the crucifixion of Jesus Christ come from Matthew and John (two eyewitnesses), Mark (who traveled with the eyewitness Peter), and Luke (who spoke with other eyewitnesses). Claiming that Paul invented the death of Jesus Christ on the cross is a statement totally inconsistent with not only the New Testament but independently verified and documented history. And as for the significance of Jesus Christ’s death – an innocent man who was God in the flesh dying in place of the guilty as a sin offering as described in Leviticus, and incidentally Barabbas took the place of the scapegoat – was not invented by Paul, but rather described in John, Matthew, Luke, and the other gospels.

The “Christianity was invented by Paul” notion is a common one of modern times, but it does not stand up to theological or historical scrutiny. In order for it to be true, Paul would have had to have written the entire New Testament rather than merely the books attributed to him.

Job Says:

July 12, 2008 at 9:29 pm

Further, for Paul to have invented Christianity, the independent historical documents from Roman and Jewish sources would have had to have been frauds as well.

paarsurrey Says:

July 13, 2008 at 2:09 am edit

Hi

I respect your opinion and faith; yet I don’t agree with you. In my opinion, Paul had contradictory concepts; one one hand he teaches that Jesus was an innocent person while on the other hand Paul’s theological philosophy is based on an accursed Jesus, which makes Jesus a wrong doer and disobedient person. I love Jesus and Mary; instead of believing mythically that Jesus was an accursed person, I would rather leave Paul and I would side with Jesus.

There is no harm in improving upon the cocepts propounded by Paul and make corrections in them to make them aligned with the simple concepts of Jesus based on OTBible, afterall Jesus and Mary were good Jews, a follower of Moses.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

The myth (not the miracle) of Jesus dying on Cross

July 11, 2008

Hi
One may find the following discussion interesting on the issue of Jesus’ death on Cross or his not dying on it.

Scott Thong Says:

July 11, 08 at vide http://scottthong.wordpress.com/2007/01/17/the-locked-tomb-mystery-whodunit/ and concludes:
I do not know where you got your information from, but I contend that it is inferior to the logic and proof of my arguments.

paarsurrey Says: The comment is awaiting moderation.
July 11, 08

Hi

I respect your faith.

I have read the write-up as contained in (http://scottthong.wordpress.com/2007/01/17/the-locked-tomb-mystery-whodunit/) the whole of it. In my opinion there is a difference between a myth and a miracle. One cannot understand a phenomenon fully unless one compares it with others writing on the subject.The PromisedMessiah 1835-1908 has explained it in detail with very sound arguments. Kindly read his book “Jesus in India” , written a hundred years ago and compare it with your views and you will know the truth for sure. It only requires a little research.
The book “Jesus in India” can be accessed here freely:

http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/index.html

Kindly read the book so that we could discuss it further. There is no harm if other persons reading our posts join in the discussion. Jesus did not die a cursed death on Cross; he was a righteous person, I love him.

The myth (not the miracle) of Jesus dying on Cross was invented by Paul at Rome, when Jesus was in exile and alive in India. There is no mystery; if there was any, that has been solved by the PromisedMessiah 1835-1908 with a Word of revelation from GodAllahYHWH.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Jesus was no sinner – an accursed person as held by Paul

July 5, 2008

First I would like to copy/paste here a post from our friend Justin and my response to him.Please don’t mind it. It is only in search for truth; else I respect the Christian religion and I love Jesus and Mary.

1. Justin Says:
July 4, 2008 at 4:33 pm edit
Islam will provide no shelter for you as a sinner. Have you ever told a lie, stolen something, or looked with lust? Then you would be guilty. See http://www.livingwaters.com/good to take the “Good Test”. Perhaps you could ever write a blog post about this test and what you think.

2. paarsurrey Says:
July 5, 2008 at 12:00 am edit
Hi
I admit, even witout writing this test, that I am a sinner. My question is who prepared this test and similiar other tests I have seen? Did Jesus prepare this test for the sinners? I don’t think he prepared it for me or you. If you are not a sinner; I congratulate you, I am not jealous of you. Now what should a sinner like me do or an innocent person like you should do? Kindly quote from Quran, OTBible or NTBible separately in this connection. The cure from sin is very important, I do agree with you.
Please don’t mind.
I love Moses, Jesus, Mary and Muhammad.
Thanks
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

While my friend has asked me to write a blogpost on sins.

My humble submission is that it is Paul who invented the theological philosophy that Jesus was an accursed person- a sinner, who died on Cross, for the atonement of the sins of the CatholicsProtestants and other Christians; never realizing the inner obvious contradictions lying hidden under this doctrine. Jesus would never say such a thing; it is a pure sinful imagination of Paul in my opinion. The sins of a person have no direct relationship with dieing of another person.

This was a cocept of the Christians for centuries; till such time that the PromisedMessiah 1835-1908 pointed it out and rescued Jesus from it and proved that Jesus never died on Cross and he could not die as Jesus was an innocent person, not an accursed person who would have died on Cross. I give hereunder an argument given by him for the benefit of our Christian friends and brothers:

“Apart from this, it was necessary that he should escape death on the cross, for it was stated in the Holy Book that whoever was hanged on the wood was accursed. It is a cruel and an unjust blasphemy to attribute a curse to an eminent person like Jesus, the Messiah, for, according to the agreed view of all who know the language, la’nat, or curse, has reference to the state of one’s heart. A man would be said to be accursed when his heart, having been estranged from God, becomes really dark; when, deprived of divine mercy and of divine love, devoid absolutely of His Knowledge, blinded like the devil, he becomes filled with the poison of unbelief; when there remains not a ray of divine love and knowledge in him; when the bond of loyalty is broken, and between him and God there arises hatred and contempt and spite and hostility, so much so that God and he become mutual enemies; and when God becomes weary of him and he becomes weary of God; in short, when he becomes an heir to all the attributes of the Devil — and that is why the Devil himself is called accursed.

It is clear that the significance of the word Mal’un, viz. accursed, is so foul that it can never apply to any righteous person who entertains love of God in his heart. Alas! Christians did not ponder over the significance of a curse when they invented this belief; else, it were impossible for them to have used such a bad word for a righteous man like Jesus. Can we say that Jesus’ heart was ever really estranged from God; that he had denied God, that he hated Him and had become His enemy? Can we ever think that Jesus had ever felt in his heart that he was estranged from God, that he was an enemy of God, and that he was immersed in the darkness of unbelief and denial? If, then, Jesus had never been in such a state of mind, that his heart was always full of love and the light of Divine Knowledge, is it for you, wise people, to ponder whether we can ever say that, not one, but thousands of curses from God had descended upon the heart of Jesus with all their evil significance? Never.

Then, how can we say that he was, God forbid, accursed? It is a pity that once a man has given utterance to something, when he has taken his stand upon a particular belief, he is not inclined to give up that belief, however much the absurdity thereof be exposed. Desire to attain salvation, if grounded upon true foundations, is a praiseworthy thing, but where is the sense in having a desire for salvation which kills truth and which countenances, regarding a holy prophet arid a perfect man, the belief that he had as it were passed through a state in which he had been estranged from God, and in which, instead of unity of heart and unity of inclination, there had been produced a strangeness and aloofness, enmity and hatred; and, instead of light, darkness had surrounded his heart?

Let it also be noticed that this not only detracts from the prophethood and apostleship of Jesus (on whom be the peace of God) but it is also derogatory to his claim to spiritual eminence, holiness, love, and knowledge of God, to which he has repeatedly given expression in the gospels.

Just look through the Bible; therein Jesus clearly claims that he is the Light of the world, that he is the Guide, and that he stands in a relation of great love towards God; that he has been honoured by a clean birth, and that he is the loved Son of God. How then, in spite of these pure and holy relations, can a curse, with all its significance, be attributed to Jesus? No, never.

Therefore, there is no doubt that Jesus was not crucified, i.e., he did not die on the Cross, for his personality did not deserve the underlying consequence of death on the Cross. Not having been crucified, he was spared the impure implications of a curse, and no doubt it also proves that he did not go to heaven, for going to heaven formed part of this whole scheme and was a consequence of the idea of his having been crucified. Therefore, when it is proved that he was neither accursed, nor did he go to hell for three days, nor did he suffer death the other part of the scheme, namely, that he went to heaven, is proved to be wrong.”
http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/ch1.html


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Paul puts on a new coat of animosity towards Jesus and Mary

June 17, 2008

 

aboulet, on June 6th, 2008 at 10.59 pm Said:

 

Ahmadi,

 

While I appreciate your comment, I believe that you have completely misunderstood and misrepresented Paul. He was born, raised, and educated as a very strict Jew, not as a pagan. His thought, therefore, is shaped by his Jewish roots, not pagan thought.

 

 

 

paarsurrey, on June 17th, 2008 at 10.35 am Said:

 

Hi friend aboulet!

 

Paul’s life account is dubious in my opinion and scholars have given their opinion on that. I don’t want to start Paul’s bashing here. My focus is primarily on Jesus and Mary whom I love. I have got no concern with Paul.

Paul never was trained as a disciple by Jesus. He was not among the twelve, it is very obvious. Paul never knew the concepts of Jesus and Mary and he never cared for them. It is on record that he was a dead enemy of Jesus and his followers.

 

When Jesus got miraculously saved by GodAllahYHWH a cursed death on Cross, and he went into exile towards the East. Perhaps Paul knew it and he put on a new coat of animosity of spoiling simple teachings of Jesus. This is what I understand; others are free to differ with me but with good reasons. I respect your faith.

 

I love Jesus, Mary and Muhammad.

 

Thanks

 

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim