Posts Tagged ‘ordinary man’

Just don’t think about it: A response

July 22, 2013

Paarsurrey says:
Thanks for the response; this will afford me a chance to review the original article by debilis @ <http://fidedubitandum.wordpress.com/> under the topic <Just Don’t Think About It>.

I wrote following post on <Just don’t think about it: A response>; the blog by Makagutu; please click on the dates below to follow the  discussion:

paarsurrey says:

I quote:
“Please tell me, how does positing god did it answer the question he posed?”

The one true “God did it” in a sense is a summary for all the stages that took place after when He commanded the words “to be”; for an ordinary man in the street who has minimum interest in the scientific details.

Debilis writes with good reasons.

paarsurrey says:

Quoting the words:
“god is a vague a word without meaning”.

Then replace “God” with Allah. Please

paarsurrey says:

Quoting the words:
““God caused it” is not a halt to inquiry at all.

And say it doesn’t halt inquiry is to be intellectually dishonest.”

There is no dishonesty in it; as I wrote earlier it is in a sense a brief reply to an ordinary person who has least interest and no capacity to understand all the scientific details. Even if somebody tells such persons the details; they cannot understand them; it is beyond their comprehension.

paarsurrey says:

Quoting the words:
“claims of materialism is circular”
They remain within the circle of matter; can’t look beyond it; while reality is not limited within the matter or the physical.
Their vision is limited within matter.; they should broaden their vision, in my opinion.

paarsurrey says:

I would like to say that the conclusions drawn are not correct.
The Word Revealed is intended for guidance of man in ethical, moral and spiritual realms. Bible is not in its original text; the debris of time has added much to it and with translation after translation the original meanings have been lost to much extent.

Anyway it was not intended as a text book of science; and those who want to take it as such are wrong.
The founders of religions like Krishna, Buddha, Zoroaster, Moses, Jesus, and Muhammad were practical men; they remained committed to the cause they were sent with from the one true God for uplift of human beings in ethical, moral and spiritual domains.
They never uttered a word even against science or the scientists; that is a separate field dealing in the material and physical things; they left it open for those who were dealing in them.
So the founders of religion did no block any field of inquiry rather they opened it wide.
Things belonging in the physical or material domains are to be left with the experts in these fields; those belonging in ethical, moral and spiritual realms are to be dealt with the verses of the Word Revealed.
There is absolutely no contradiction there, in my opinion.

Random thoughts

You have met Debilis, our resident apologist whose main occupation is either to attack the claims of materialism or New Atheists without supporting his claims. To engage with him on his posts is usually a slippery affair because one can hardly ever pin point what it is he is defending. Having said that, let us look at this post.

There seem to be two basic explanations for the origin of all physical reality (i.e. the universe):

1. God caused it
2. There is no explanation

He starts with a fallacy of false dilemma, one has to choose either of the two of answers. He is led to this problem by assuming that the sum of all reality must have a beginning. Once on the path he has taken, to get out of it, one has to resort either to superstition or consult reason on his path.

After leading…

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I deny deity to Science and the Scientists; if any

February 11, 2010

http://forum.richarddawkins.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=109230&p=2719722#p2719722

paarsurrey wrote:

Hi friends

I am an ordinary man in the street. I don’t have any claim to scholarship or any piety. I respect scientists; they are intelligent people; they discover and invent things and I am thankful to them. I buy things from the market discovered and invented by them and I am entitled to use those things as I have paid for them. I am grateful to the technicians and other artisans who make things convenient for me and I pay them for their services. I enjoy sports and I pay for that. I enjoy artists; they paint beautiful paintings; and I do pay for their paintings if I like to buy them. They are my partners in my life; but I don’t think I have any reason to prefer one for the other. Why should I consider a Scientist to have any hegemony over me? Science is not the whole of human life; it is only a part of it. The Scientists never create anything from nothing; they only discover things that are very much already in existence in the Universe. I respect the Scientists but I admire, thank and gratify the Creator- God Allah YHWH who had in fact created everything in me and around me. I think I have a right to do so. Am I right?

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

the PC apeman wrote :

Yes, science is just a way of knowing and knowing isn’t the whole of human life. More to the purposes of this forum, do you claim to have a way of knowing other than science?

paarsurrey wrote:

Hi friend the PC apeman

I think science is a product of philosophy; rather it is one branch of philosophy, please correct me if I am wrong. Knowledge could be acquired by many means never ever limited by Science or patented by the Scientists. I consider this Universe as the Work of the Creator -God Allah YHWH; yes science is a good faculty of human beings; but it exists only as the Universe has a system in its creation which alludes to a Creator of it, in my opinion. Had the Universe not been created / evolved in a natural system; the Scientists would have not been able to bring it in a system or create a system in it? Science, therefore, presupposes things in a system and not chaotic.

Another source of knowledge, to me, rather a superior source is Revelation from the Creator- God Allah YHWH.

When I pay the customary fees to my Physician for the treatment he has given to me; what more morally I am supposed to do or feel about him? After all the Physician is not my god; he gives treatment to me not from anything created by him; but from things already in existence; courtesy the Creator- God Allah YHWH.

I deny deity to Science and the Scientists; if any

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Would Noah or Moses or Jonah doubt God with whom they were in conversation with and it required no witnesses? Jesus was no different.

May 3, 2009

paul8bee says:

How are you?

I try not to get too caught up in religious theory. There is just too so much theory around that it tends to confuse people more than it enlightens them. I consider myself to be a Theologist; this means that I would be a fool to join in any organized religion. I study Truth, not Dogma.
The truth should be plain and simple to understand.

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friend paul8bee

May God Allah YHWH bless you!

I am fine with the grace of Allah.

I am OK, with if you are a Theologist; I am just an ordinary man in the street. I love a person and his company who follows the truth and not the Dogma. I agree that the truth should be plain and simple to understand as it is for the benefit of the masses; Jesus was such a truthful person until Paul hijacked his teachings and acts and complicated everything with his own Theological Philosophy to his own benefit, it is another thing that God punished Paul for his wrongs in terms of Deuteronomy.

The Message of God Allah YHWH received through truthful Messengers Prophets has always been very simple; one could see this message in the life accounts of Noah or Moses or Jonah. One could observe it oneself. They received Word from God in a simple one to one basis, needing no witnesses, as that tantamount to doubts. Would Noah or Moses or Jonah doubt with who they were in conversation? Jesus was also one like that.

It is the Church who created false Witnesses. One could ask the scribes what and why they were witnessing. If they had not born; would that had effected the truthfulness of Jesus? Jesus never needed cunning Paul or the sinful scribes as witnesses. God Allah YHWH had selected Jesus and he was sufficient for the witnessing and support. This is very simple to understand.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran and not as presented by Paul or the sinful scribes.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim