Posts Tagged ‘Noah’

Contradictions in Bible show Bible is not preserved in its original form

April 27, 2013

I quote below from Bible:

Genesis 7:1

Noe with his family go into the ark. The deluge overflows the earth.
[1] And the Lord said to him: Go in thou and all thy house into the ark: for thee I have seen just before me in this generation. [2] Of all clean beasts take seven and seven, the male and the female.

http://www.drbo.org/chapter/01009.htm

Genesis 7:1

1The LORD then said to Noah, “Go into the ark, you and your whole family, because I have found you righteous in this generation.

http://niv.scripturetext.com/genesis/7.htm

Genesis 9:9-12

[9] Behold I will establish my covenant with you, and with your seed after you: [10] And with every living soul that is with you, as well in all birds as in cattle and beasts of the earth, that are come forth out of the ark, and in all the beasts of the earth.[11] I will establish my covenant with you, and all flesh shall be no more destroyed with the waters of a flood, neither shall there be from henceforth a flood to waste the earth. [12] And God said: This is the sign of the covenant which I give between me and you, and to every living soul that is with you, for perpetual generations.

http://www.drbo.org/chapter/01009.htm

Genesis 9:20-22

[20] And Noe, a husbandman, began to till the ground, and planted a vineyard.
[21] And drinking of the wine was made drunk, and was uncovered in his tent. [22] Which when Cham the father of Chanaan had seen, to wit, that his father’ s nakedness was uncovered, he told it to his two brethren without.

http://www.drbo.org/chapter/01009.htm

  1. Noe was righteous and for this he was chosen and a covenant was made with him.
  2. It was promised that there would be no more floods in Earth after the deluge.
  3. Nakedness was a sin and Noe got drunk and became naked; it was his fault; but he was not punished and yet he distributed his blessing to his favorite son.

Floods did not cease even after the deluge; the covenant was not fulfilled. Noe did not remain innocent and became sinful, as stated in the Bible.

Obviously, it is the scribes who tried to make Noe sinful while he was an innocent person.

Hence, Bible is not preserved in its original form. Genesis is not covered in the warning of the revelation which is specific, if at all, for revelation and cannot be extended generally to other books.

 

 

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Son of God, Alpha Omega, Word Incarnate, Lamb of God: only parables

November 14, 2009

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=4808

Shaunm1963 wrote:

AND if you LOVE Jesus and Mary (as mentioned in the Koran) do you also believe that Jesus is the Son of God and the Word Incarnate and the Alpha and Omega and the Lamb of God? What do you MEAN you LOVE them???

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friend Shaunm1963

Yes, I love Jesus and Mary like I love all the Messengers Prophets mentioned in Quran i.e. Moses, Moses’ mother, Noah, Jonah etc. They were exemplary personalities for the human beings; that is why they were selected by the Creator-God Allah YHWH as Models for humanity.

1. I don’t believe Jesus to be son of god, in its literal meaning; yes I believe that he was one of the persons whom the Creator- God loved.

2. Jesus was never a Word incarnate in its literal meaning; but in the meaning that all the Messenger Prophets fulfilled the purpose of the creations of human beings; in that sense all the Messengers are the Word incarnate; nothing special with Jesus.

3. In the same sense all Messengers are Alpha and Omega; in the image of the Creator- God Allah YHWH; and they fulfill the purpose of human creation.

4. All the Messengers have to suffer and make sacrifices in the way of the Creator- God Allah YHWH; they are all Lambs of God, nothing special with Jesus.

5. Jesus talked in parables; the sinful and deserting scribes and the Church did not understand the parables sometimes and took it literally; they carved myths from the parables, we don’t have to follow their mistakes unnecessarily for nothing.

The human society is and must be rational, reasonable and logical; it cannot live in mythical castles. It is for this that I say the Jesus of Bible is no more relevant in the West. Jesus and Mary of Quran are real and relevant for the West and hence they must be loved as their celebrities.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran; not the mythical ones as mentioned by the cunning Paul and sinful scribes in the NT.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

The Creator Selects and Appoints the Messengers

November 11, 2009

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=4468&p=79321#p79321

paarsurrey wrote:

Hi friends

It is not Muslims considering the choice of making Muhammad a Messenger Prophet of the Creator-God Allah YHWH. It is the Creator who selects and appoints a perfect human on this office. Let us see what happened in the time of Noah as mentioned in Quran:

[71:1] In the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.
[71:2] We sent Noah to his people, saying, ‘Warn thy people before there comes upon them a grievous punishment.’
[71:3] He said, ‘O my people! surely I am a plain Warner unto you,
[71:4] ‘That you serve Allah and fear Him and obey me.
[71:5] ‘He will forgive you your sins and grant you respite till an appointed time. Verily the time appointed by Allah cannot be put back when it comes, if only you knew!’
[71:6] He said, “My Lord, I have called my people night and day,
[71:7] “But my calling them has only made them flee from me all the more.
[71:8] “And every time I called them that Thou mightest forgive them, they put their fingers into their ears, and covered up their hearts, and persisted in their iniquity, and were disdainfully proud.
[71:9] “Then, I called them to righteousness openly.
[71:10] “Then I preached to them in public, and also spoke to them in private. [71:11] “And I said, ‘Seek forgiveness of your Lord; for He is the Great Forgiver. [71:12] ‘He will send down rain for you in abundance,
[71:13] ‘And He will strengthen you with wealth and with children, and He will give you gardens and He will give you rivers.
[71:14] ‘What is the matter with you that you expect not wisdom and staidness from Allah?
[71:15] ‘And He has created you in different forms and different conditions. [71:16] ‘Have you not seen how Allah has created seven heavens in perfect harmony,
[71:17] ‘And has placed the moon therein as a light, and made the sun as a lamp? [71:18] ‘And Allah has caused you to grow as a good growth from the earth,

http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/sh … 1&verse=10

So, like Noah other Messengers Prophets have been selected by the Creator- God Allah YHWH. They have to be accepted by other human being for their ethical, moral and spiritual uplift.

Paarsurrey wrote:

Hi friends

I like your gesture for not opposing my above post for almost a weak. I am happy that my Atheist Agnostic friends have accepted a very natural approach as mentioned above that the Messenger Prophets are selected by the Creator – God Allah YHWH; this is very essential in terms of evolution of Man.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

“The Bible cannot be taken literally”

October 29, 2009

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/panelists/rebecca_goldstein/2009/10/god_and_the_moral_muddle.html#comments

Hi friends

“The Bible cannot be taken literally”

We know that the Messengers Prophets of the Creator – God Allah YHWH, like Moses, Noah, Abraham and Jesus did receive Word of Revelation from Him. But unfortunately the Original Revelation has not been preserved literally and has been lost in the debris of time. We only get the glimpses of the Creator- God Allah YHWH’s Word. So definitely one does not get the true meaning and hence the true sense of it. I therefore agree that the Bible cannot be taken literally sometimes.

But at least we can understand academically that the Revelation had been received from God Allah YHWH. The lost part of the Bible or its ethical, moral and spiritual teachings can however be recovered/ modified or understood.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

“One more little question; did Joseph Smith believe that Jesus was God?”Ah, this little question is a really big question

June 7, 2009

Markparker1 says:

“One more little question; did Joseph Smith believe that Jesus was God?”

Ah, this little question is a really big question.

Firstly we do not believe in the Trinity as adopted by Christian sects around the 4th century after Christ.

Paarsurrey says:

Well, Jesus was an upright person; he neither believed in Trinity nor in Duality. Jesus’ belief was as simple as of Moses, Abraham, Noah and Jonah; as they were with the same Message from God Allah YHWH.

It becomes clealr to me that Joseph Smith was neither visited by God Allah YHWH nor by Jesus. The conclusion drwan by the Mormons are neither depicted in the text of the first vision of Joseph Smith, nor are in confirmity with the context of the beliefs of Moses, Abraham, Noah, Jonah and Jesus and other Prophest of the Old Testament.

Paul and Joseph Smith seem to be the same complicated persons; had got nothing to do with Jesus or God Allah YHWH; hence their destiny was similar; they were killed in terms of Deuteronmy; as they were never legitimately appointed by by God Allah YHWH in the first place.

I don’t mind if somebody wants to covert me to his faith; this is his right, which he should establish rightly.

One of our friends, Maaark, who is also an ex-LDS person has aloso commented in this connection, you may if you like reply his understandings in the matter.

I love Jesus and Mary as depicted in Quran; not the ones described by Paul or Joseph Smith.

Please don’t mind; you are a friend. I don’t have anything against you or the Mormon Christians, we are just discussing the things in search of truth and comparing our notes. I respect your faith and you have a right to defend your faith; which please continue doing boldly. There is no intention to malign the Mormon Christians, a good people.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Jesus was only one of God’s created men and with a Message from God Allah YHWH; like was Noah or Jonah; Jesus never asked anyone to worship him or to pray from him

June 5, 2009

Yourbrotherinchrist says:

Thank you for inviting me to read today’s message and post a response. Please let me know if ever I can support you in prayer in any way. Though you have not accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you are still my family, and I love you. More importantly and wonderfully, Jesus loves you. He will be waiting for you with open arms should you ever decide to turn to Him.

Have a wonderful and blessed rest of the day.

Your brother in Christ,

Rev Jason Thurwanger

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friend yourbrotherinchrist

You are always welcome to pray for me; best wishes of my friends make me happy.

While praying for me, please pray to the ONE to whom Jesus used to pray to; i.e God Allah YHWH. Jesus was only one of his created men and with a Message from God Allah YHWH; like were Noah or Jonah.

I seek love of God Allah YHWH; you can pray for me that He gets pleased with me and makes me near to Him.
I think that would do.

Nice responding me; may God Allah YHWH bless you!

I love Jesus and Mary as beautifully and truthfully described in Quran.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

One can view full comments/post of yourbrotherinchrist by accessing:

https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2009/06/04/jesus-went-from-one-country-to-another-and-at-nightfall-wherever-he-was-he-used-to-eat-the-vegetation-of-the-jungle-and-to-drink-pure-water/#comments

No fake witnessing of Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and Paul was needed by Jesus

June 3, 2009

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friends

I quote from John 8:19.

John 8:
16 And if I do judge, my judgment is true: because I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me. 17 And in your law it is written, that the testimony of two men is true. 18 I am one that give testimony of myself: and the Father that sent me giveth testimony of me. 19 They said therefore to him: Where is thy Father? Jesus answered: Neither me do you know, nor my Father: if you did know me, perhaps you would know my Father also.

http://www.drbo.org/chapter/50008.htm

The sinful scribes or the Church as depicted by Bible; did follow the Jews, instead of following Jesus. Jesus maintained that he needed no witnessing for his truthfulness.

God Allah YHWH was sufficient for his witnessing that Jesus was a Messenger of God; sent by God Allah YHWH with a message.

Moses did not need a witnessing of men; Noah did not need a witnessing of men; Jonah did not need a witnessing of men. All these persons Moses, Noah, Jonah and Jesus were to judge the people; they were not to be judged by them.

When people denied them, the Messengers; they were punished by God Allah YHWH; one should read what happened to the people to whom Noah was sent; when they denied the Message of Noah, they all got drowned.

So, only witnessing of Allah and his Messenger is sufficient; no fake witnessing of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John was needed by Jesus.

Peace; I respect your faith; you are free to believe whatever you are convinced with.

I love Jesus and Mary as described in Quran.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Jesus of Bible is hardly above the status of Adam; nevertheless both Adam and Jesus were innocent and perfect men

June 1, 2009

Maaark says:

I wonder what Muslims believe about perfection? Do you believe there are perfect people?

Paarsurrey says:

Yes, we Ahmadi peaceful Muslims do believe that all Messengers Prophets of God Allah YHWH were perfect persons; like Noah, Moses, Jonah and John the Baptist.

One such person was Adam whom Jesus adopted as his father; Jesus of Bible frequently said that he was Son of Man or Son of Adam. Jesus of Bible is hardly above the status of Adam; nevertheless both Adam and Jesus were innocent and perfect men.

I love Jesus, Adam, Moses, Noah, Jonah, John the Baptist as illustrated in Quran.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Paul eulogized Jesus; only to deprive Jesus from his true personage

May 29, 2009

Mark Anderson says:

This attachment is a study of Paul I did myself about 10 years ago. I was asking if he was a true follower of Jesus. For someone to be an apostle, which means like an ambassador or representative, they must reflect the character of the one who sends. It is maybe too long for your interest. But you might look at the first 3 pages.
Mark

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friend Mark Anderson

Thanks for sending me your research article on Paul and suggesting to me to read it.

Jesus was a straightforward man like Moses or Jonah or Noah. They conveyed the Message they received from God Allah YHWH to the people they were sent to.

Jesus was one like them; though he might have used some parables to explain things; without any intention of complicating the things or putting people in confusion.

I just want that people should know the real Jesus. If I see that the basic character of Jesus as mentioned by me above and his psyche is being undermined; and he is being overshadowed by somebody cleverly, like Paul did; only to that extent I will expose such person.

I have no interest or intention to start Paul bashing or the scribes of the gospels; I only want that the real Jesus should shine out.

Paul eulogized Jesus; only to deprive Jesus from his true personage. Jesus is a real entity to me; Paul and scribes are no entity to me.

Sorry, I don’t agree that Paul was Jesus like or an attorney or a representative or an ambassador of Jesus.

That does not mean that you should unnecessarily believe what I believe; there is no compulsion in matters of faith or religion. Peace; I respect your faith. Please don’t mind.

I love Jesus as I do love Moses, Noah and Jonah.

Thanks and regards to you, your family and your friends. May God bless you all!

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

The True Book from God – the Creator, is logically the one which conforms to His law of nature, and the true Divine Word is that which does not contradict His action

May 11, 2009

~It is not true that God’s Action as mentioned in the Bible should point to one thing and His word to another

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad 1835-1908, the Promised Messiah, the Second Coming says:

This is what Allah teaches us in the Holy Quran:
‘The recompense of an injury is an injury the like thereof;
but whoso forgives and his act brings about reformation,15
his reward is with Allah.’
This is the teaching of the Holy Quran. The Gospel, on
the other hand, teaches unconditional forgiveness at all
times, and thus tramples upon all sense of expediency on
which the social structure is based. It only emphasizes the
growth of one branch of the ‘tree’ of human ethics, and
completely disregards all the others.

But, strangely enough, Jesus (as) did not act upon his own
moral teachings. He cursed the fig tree when he found it
to be barren, while he exhorted others to pray. And while
he taught others not to call anyone a fool, he himself went
to the extent of calling the Jewish elders misbegotten,
hurling abuses at them in every sermon and calling them
foul names. A teacher of morals must first exhibit those
morals in himself. Could such a flawed teaching, which
Jesus (as) himself did not follow, be from God?

The only pure and perfect teaching is that of the Holy
Quran, which nourishes all human faculties. It does not
emphasize any one aspect, rather it teaches a judicious
exercise of both forgiveness and chastisement. In truth,
the Holy Quran is a reflection of the Divine law of nature
which we witness all around us. It stands to reason that
there should be harmony between God’s word and action.
The action of God, as we see it in this world, must necessarily
be the basis for the word of God contained in His
True Book—not that His Action should point to one thing
and His word to another. With regard to His action, we
observe that forgiveness is by no means the rule, and that
He also inflicts upon the wrongdoers various kinds of
punishments, which have been mentioned in earlier scriptures
as well. Our God is not only Forbearing, but He is
also most severe in His wrath.

The True Book, therefore,
is the one which conforms to His law of nature, and the
true Divine Word is that which does not contradict His
action. We have never observed God to be continually
forbearing and forgiving towards His creatures and never
punishing them. Even today God has warned the wicked
people through me and has told of a powerful and terrible
earthquake which will destroy them; and the plague has
not yet subsided either. Do you not remember what happened
to the people of Noah (as) and what befell the nation
of Lot (as)?

Do understand that the essence of the Shariah is
, which means to adopt the attributes of the
Exalted and Glorious God. This is the highest perfection a
soul can attain. The desire to acquire morals greater than
God’s, is sheer blasphemy, and amounts to an attack on
His holy attributes.
You should also consider that it is God’s eternal and established
law that He forgives in response to repentance
and penitence, and hears the prayers of His righteous servants
which are offered by way of intercession.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Foot Notes:

14 Al-Shura, 42:41 [Publishers]
15 The Holy Quran does not approve of that forgiveness which serves no
good purpose, for it only corrupts human morals and creates disorder in
society. The Holy Quran only sanctions that forgiveness which results in
reformation. [Author]

http://www.alislam.org/library/books/Fountain-of-Christianity-20080505MN.pdf