Posts Tagged ‘crucifixion of jesus’

Pontius Pilate: Jesus Christ: Empty Tomb: Bible

March 24, 2014

http://jerichobrisance.com/2014/03/20/pontius-our-pilot-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-5492

paarsurrey says:
March 24, 2014 at 6:28 am

@JERICHO BRISANCE
“From a historical point of view, the reader should ask a very sensible question at this point: how does Mark know what passed between Jesus and Pilate at all?”

It is a good question; a good idea.

http://jerichobrisance.com/2014/03/20/pontius-our-pilot-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-5493

paarsurrey says:
March 24, 2014 at 6:39 am

@JERICHO BRISANCE
“or (Mark) working from rumors that may have passed around at second or third hand from Roman soldiers or Jewish accusers.”

I agree with you.
All NT Gospels consist of the second and or third hand (nobody know for sure how many hands?) information or rumors.
Like Matthew says that all the disciples of Jesus fled away from the site of Crucifixion of Jesus; then either he himself was not a disciple of Jesus to narrate the events or he was narrating it on the “evidence” of rumors he liked most.

Regards

http://jerichobrisance.com/2014/03/20/pontius-our-pilot-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-5496

paarsurrey says:

March 24, 2014 at 6:52 am

@archaeopteryx1 says: March 22, 2014 at 4:19 pm
“You left out the discovery of the empty tomb.”

Jesus could himself roll out the stone and get out of the tomb; after treatment of his wounds by the physicians in the tomb; that could be the “mystery” of the empty tomb.

Regards

Clues hidden under the apparent surface of the text of Bible come to light

March 12, 2014

I have given response to the following comments of my Catholic friend “trueandreasonable”

http://trueandreasonable.co/
https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2014/03/10/christians-should-accept-jesus-core-teachings-of-jesus/#comment-4314

https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2014/03/10/christians-should-accept-jesus-core-teachings-of-jesus/#comment-4318

paarsurrey Says:
March 12, 2014 at 12:31 pm | Reply edit

@ trueandreasonable :March 11, 2014 at 11:46 pm
I am pleased to learn that you are Catholic; I always hold them with high esteem.

I will discuss your second passage at first.

It is your blind faith or that is what you have been made to believe by sinful Paul and the Church that innocent Jesus died on the Cross. It is not history as it never happened actually.
Paul invented this creed or myth for a purpose or for his vested interest; may be not for much financial gains but otherwise. I don’t want to start Paul bashing though; yet for the love of innocent Jesus I have to decipher the coded truth.

Those who commit stealing always leave clues by which an intelligent person would locate the stealers. Those who deceive also keep other things unchanged for credulity to the ordinary persons and only change things or fabricate things only the ones which support their purpose.

If one analyzes the events of the Bible, which you know was not written by Jesus; where the accounts of crucifixion of Jesus has been narrated; it is not difficult to find the clues hidden under the apparent surface of the text.
Evidences that Jesus did not die on the Cross but he got miraculously survived always existed but the first person who combined all such material in the form of a small book of about 122 pages titled “Jesus in India” is written by Mirza Ghulam Ahmad 1835-1908 the Promised Messiah.

The main points of the book “Jesus in India” are given below:

1. Jesus did not die on the Cross; he survived a cursed death on it.
2. Jesus was treated for his injuries inflicted on him on the Cross in the tomb of Joseph of Arimathea.
3. When Jesus’ injuries on the Cross were healed to the extent he could make a journey; he came out of the tomb and he met his disciples secretly to tell them that he survived and is the same person with the same body he had before he was put on the Cross.
4. Then he went to Galilee; he did not and could not ascend to heavens; instead he secretly going up the hill went towards India; along with his mother Mary.
5. Jesus traveled to India in search of and to meet the ten lost tribes of house of Israel who were settled in different parts of India.
6. The book provided the root map of Jesus travel to India.
7. Jesus visited different part of India and ultimately settled in Kashmir, India.
8. He died a natural and physical death in India; and his grave is still found at Mohalla Khanyar, Srinagar, Kashmir, India.
9. Jesus is not to come again literally and physically and his symbolic Second Coming has been fulfilled in the person of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad 1835-1908.

I give below the headings of the chapters of the book just for introduction of the contents of the same.

Chapter 1
• Evidence from the Gospels
Chapter 2
• Evidence from the Quran and Authentic traditions
Chapter 3
• Evidence derived from Medical Literature
• List of Books mentioning Marham-i-Isa (ointment of Jesus), and that the Ointment was Prepared for Jesus’ Wounds
Chapter 4
• Evidence from Historical Records
Section 1:
• Evidence from Islamic literature concerning Jesus’ journeys
• Probable Route Map of Jesus’ Journey to India
Section 2:
• Evidence from Buddhist Records
Section 3:
• Evidence from Historical Writings which Show that Jesus’ Journey to the Punjab and Neighbouring Territories was Inevitable
• List of 24 Tribes of Abdalees
Appendix

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_in_India_(book)

The book is available online in PDF format freely; the link given below.

Click to access Jesus-in-India.pdf

Thanks

Value of myrrh and aloe brought by Nicodemus -2

June 10, 2013

Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad- the Promised Messiah (AS) has written a useful chapter on the above; I give here q  passage from his book “Jesus in India”.

The Promised Messiah says:

Quote

“A piece of evidence of great value with regard to the escape of Jesus from the Cross, which no one can help admitting, is a medical preparation known as Marham-i-Isa or the ‘Ointment of Jesus’ recorded in hundreds of medical books. Some of these books were compiled by Christians, some by Magians or Jews, some by Muslims. Most of them are very old.

Investigations show that in the beginning the preparation came to be known as an oral tradition among hundreds of thousands of people. Then they recorded it. At first, in the very time of Jesus, a little after the event of the Cross, a pharmaceutical work was compiled in Latin, in which there was a mention of this preparation along with the statement that the preparation had been prepared for the wounds of Jesus.

Next, this work was translated into several languages, until, in the time of Mamun-al-Rashid, it was translated into Arabic. It is, moreover, a strange result of divine intervention that eminent physicians of all religions — Christian, Jew, Magian, or Muslim — have all mentioned this preparation in their books, and have stated that it was prepared for Jesus by the disciples. A study of books on pharmacology shows that this preparation is very useful in cases of injuries due to blows or falls, arresting immediately the flow of blood; and as it also contains ‘myrrh’ the wound remains aseptic. The ointment is also useful in plague; it is good for boils and ulcers of all kinds.

It is, however, not clear whether the ointment was prepared, as a result of divine revelation, by Jesus himself after he had undergone the suffering of the Cross, or, that it was prepared after consultation with some physician. Some of its ingredients are like specifics; especially ‘myrrh’ which is mentioned also in the Torah. In any case, the wounds of Jesus healed up in a few days by the use of this ointment. Within three days he recovered sufficiently to be able to march seventy miles on foot from Jerusalem to Galilee.

Hence, regarding the efficacy of this preparation it is enough to say that while Jesus healed others, this preparation healed Jesus! The Books which record this fact number more than one thousand. To mention them all would be too long. As, moreover, the prescription is a famous one among the Yunani (i.e., those versed in ancient Greek medicine) physicians, I do not see any need to state the titles of all these books: I set down below the titles of only a few which are available here.” Unquote

List of books containing a mention of Marham-i-Isa,
and a statement that the ointment was prepared for
Jesus, i.e., for the wounds on his body

http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/ch3.htmlPlease click the above link to see the list and the rest of the write up.

Value of myrrh and aloe brought by Nicodemus

June 10, 2013

I give here a write-up written on the website <http://www.tombofjesus.com> for the benefit of the viewers of this blog:

Quote

“Aloe and Myrrh

Modern day analysis on the most ancient of herbs. Known for being applied to Jesus once in the tomb and assumed to be part of an embalming process, what role do these herbs play in the world today?

Later, Joseph of Arimathea asked Pilate for the body of Jesus. Now Joseph was a disciple of Jesus, but secretly because he feared the Jews. With Pilate’s permission, he came and took the body away. He was accompanied by Nicodemus, the man who earlier had visited Jesus at night. Nicodemus brought a mixture of myrrh and aloes, about seventy-five pounds.Taking Jesus’ body, the two of them wrapped it, with the spices, in strips of linen. This was in accordance with Jewish burial customs.” John 19:38-40

For thousands of years the herbs Aloe and Myrrh have held special relevance in the Christian world. Even modern day encyclopaedias mention the events of the Crucifixion of Jesus in their analysis of the herbs. These herbs are mentioned as being used in the burial of Jesus, for instance we find an entry for Myrrh stating:

“Myrrh is a constituent of perfumes and incense, and was highly prized in ancient times. Myrrh was one of the gifts of the Magi to the baby Jesus in the story told in the Gospel of Matthew. Myrrh was used as an incense in funerals and cremations, a fact alluded to in the Christmas carol We Three Kings”(www.Wikipedia.com – online encyclopedia)

Other sources outline how Aloe was thought to have been used during the embalming process of the Egyptians 1 What becomes interesting, however, is what is actually said about the medicinal properties of the herb. It is often cited that one of its famous occurrences is in the Gospel of John during the burial of Christ and this event may have shaped people’s perceived view of its uses. Upon examination of its documented properties all sources talk about its remarkable healing properties. It is accepted that even the Greeks and Romans as early as 300BC were aware of the healing properties of aloes:

“Aristotle was aware that the healing properties of aloe would be invaluable to soldiers wounded in battle and advised his student Alexander III (“the Great”) to conquer all lands that grew it, especially the island of Socotra off the coast of eastern Africa… Pedanius Dioscorides, a physician in the Roman army, mentioned medicinal aloes in his encyclopedic Greek herbal De Materia Medica (Approximately around 75 BC). ” 2

“The healing benefits of aloe were recognized in the ancient Indian, Chinese, Greek, and Roman civilizations. It is traditionally used to heal wounds, relieve itching and swelling, and is known for its anti-inflammatory and antibacterial properties.” 3

Myrrh also is a herb that although often linked to Jesus and his burial was clearly recognised at the time as a healing agent. Aloe is talked about as having properties that help wounds heal and aid the reformation of skin, where as Myrrh is used more for anti inflammatory and anti bacterial reasons:

“In the past myrrh was used by many cultures for religious ceremonies and as a healing agent. It was mentioned in the Bible as a gift at the birth of Christ. The Egyptians believed in its healing powers: they burned it every day as part of their worshipping rituals. In the Greek culture when soldiers went to battle is was an essential part of their combat gear because of myrrhs extremely high antiseptic and anti-inflammatory properties. It was used to clean wounds and to prevent infection. It was also used to prevent the spread of gangrene in already infected parts of the body. ” 4

Embalming

Were the herbs not used for embalming the body of Jesus? From the sources seen so far the idea of embalming using aloe has only surfaced in the Egyptian world. It is thought that pharaohs were buried along with aloes. Was Jesus being embalmed? The problem occurs when Jewish burial practices are examined. Jewish burial involved simply washing the body and burying it, there was no embalming. For a body to be embalmed incisions needed to be made. This was understood by the people of the time, and for Jews to make such incisions would not be acceptable. Upon the advent of the passing away of Judah, one of the ancestors of modern day Jews, he is recorded as having stated:

“I die this day at the age of one hundred and nineteen years before your eyes. None shall bury me in a costly garment, nor shall ye cut my body to embalm it, but ye shall carry me to Hebron.” Having spoken these words, Judah sank into death.5

It seems unlikely that the aloes present were for embalming, also having myrrh there also in large quantities was not consistent with this hypothesis. If the viewpoint is taken that Jesus could possibly have still been alive at this point, and that Joseph of Arimithea and Nicodemus who were tending to him had knowledge of herbs, then the possible role of these herbs becomes clear.

Could they have been used to treat Jesus and to help him recover from his ordeal?

Modern Day Use

Today there is an increasing amount of usage of Aloes in products. Gillette series shaving foam now contains what the can calls “Soothing Aloes”, and a wide range of aloe-based creams and gels are available mainly for healing of the skin 6.

Perhaps the most definitive answer on the properties of aloes comes from a book written by medical experts. “Aloes: The Genus Aloe (Medicinal & Aromatic Plants S. – Industrial Profiles)” edited by Tom Reynolds represents the most details study yet in to this fascinating herb. Detailed analysis of the herb is presented and an entire part is devoted to exploring “therapeutic activity and includes chapters on aloe’s role in wound healing, skin cancer, and the immune system.7

Diane Gage has chosen to title her book on the subject “Aloe Vera: Nature’s Soothing Healer” and her text discusses the biological properties of aloe vera, explaining its power to heal the human body, and traces the ways the plant has been used throughout history.

Conclusion

Aloe and Myrrh appear to be ideal herbs for treating someone who had suffered an ordeal such as crucifixion. Their reported presence at the crucifixion does arouse some suspicion as to the events that followed Jesus’ removal from the cross.

Were they used simply for embalming or fragrant use as is traditionally understood, or were their excellent healing and antiseptic properties employed instead to help heal Jesus’ wounds and to aid his recovery from an ordeal he survived?”

Unquote

http://www.tombofjesus.com/index.php/en/component/content/article/53-crucifixion/events/76-aloe-and-myrrh

OOO

The News:

One will, perhaps, love to read the following:

“Holy War”: Is it Armageddon? with its ” Peaceful Version”! 1

“Holy War”: Is it Armegiddon / Armageddon? – with its “Peaceful Version”! 1 | paarsurrey (wordpress.com)

One will be taken aback to note that Armegiddon/Armageddon is nothing like as one would have imagined or known so far. It is not to be fought with any physical and destructive weaponry and or the lethal arsenal of the day. It is peaceful and in fact, I understand, it has already started and it is sown like a seed!

It was a debate between the Pauline-Christianity (represented by Mr. Abdullah Atham) and the Second Coming 1835-1908 , that took place in Urdu language and was published then by the name “Jang-e-Muqaddas” in 1893 ( 22 May 1893 to 5 June 1893) in the then British India and has been recently translated and published in English by the name “The Holy War”:

The Holy War — A DEBATE BETWEEN ISLAM & CHRISTIANITY — Jang-e-Muqaddas (alislam.org)

Right?

From: a peaceful Ahmadiyya Muslim

OOO  

These are the days of Armageddon – the final battle between good and evil –The peaceful Version! 3 

Has Armageddon already started with the advent of Second Coming 1835-1908 ?– The peaceful Version! 2

What is the significance of “Nicodemus (bringing) 75 lbs aloe and myrrh”?

November 11, 2008

Paarsurrey says:

WordPress.com has informed me that someone referred my blog via Search Engine Terms and desired of me to provide the information as to what is the significance of “Nicodemus (bringing) 75 lbs aloe and myrrh”when Jesus was laid in the Armithea’s tomb after the event of Crucifixion.

I preferred to use internet search engine for ( nicodemus 75 lbs aloe and myrrh).

From the entries which came to surface, I have selected some to present before the readers of this blog:

Research Results

Nine Articles by Luis Silva – Jesus
… and thorax during violent treatment (75 … They refer to the 100 lb. Of aromatic substances which Nicodemus procured (John 19 … The Gospels mention that an aloe and myrrh was used.
o http://www.globusz.com/ebooks/LuisSilva/00000016.htm
o • Cached page

Newsvine – Yoga at school causes stress among some
Nicodemus brought 75 lbs of aloes and myrrh to Jesus’s tomb. What was this for? It wasn’t for embalming, Jewish tradition forbids embalming. Aloe is one of the best natural …
o xoxchi.newsvine.com/_news/2008/10/03/1950880-yoga-at-school-causes-stress-among-some
o • Cached page

The Society of Christ and Magazine
… close to six feet long (1,8 m) and weighed about 66 lb … us that in this Joseph of Arimathea was aided by Nicodemus, who brought with him about one hundred pounds of myrrh and aloe.
o http://www.loveoneanothermagazine.org/pdfs/pdfs_mag_eng/LOA_000-pilot.pdf
• Cached page

I clicked the second item of research: Newsvine – Yoga at school causes stress among some , the discussion took a turn and the item of our research became the issue:

http://xoxchi.newsvine.com/_news/2008/10/03/1950880-yoga-at-school-causes-stress-among-some

lrose-614849

What makes you think Jesus didn’t do yoga? What makes you think “god” is so limited as to be threatened by another way of approaching spirituality? And, what makes you think that the Christian doctrine of following the son to the father so as to be one with him is not similar to extinguishing the ego self into the Brahman state?
Why are fundamentalists so literal? I mean, really, what would Jesus think of such narrow mindedness and intolerance?

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#29 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 11:36 AM EDT

Uthaclena

Why are fundamentalists so literal?

I would suspect that there is something very tribal or “Us vs. “Them” for some people, both from the way they have been raised, and perhaps some biological tendencies as well. You see this territorialness in other animal species, not just among us humans. Also, note that some people love new ideas and concepts and experiment with alternatives, and other people such things make them fearful, creaqte what psychology calls “cognitive dissonance,” and they actively reject them. Maybe something biochemical, like variations in stimulus or pain thresholds?
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#29.1 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 12:32 PM EDT

XNihil0Zer0

Yeah you’d think they’d be more understanding considering Jesus survived the crucifixion and travelled to Kashmir. Srinagar is a mainly hindu and buddhist city so I’m sure he was exposed to plenty of yoga before he died.
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#29.2 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 3:09 PM EDT

mdbrda

I think you should check your facts
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#29.3 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 5:19 PM EDT

XNihil0Zer0

Against what O’ Master of Facts?
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#29.4 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 5:21 PM EDT

mdbrda

The Bible, perhaps?
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#29.5 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 5:43 PM EDT

XNihil0Zer0

So that’s the big book O’ facts?
I like the fact that the bible says Jesus died only six hours after being on the cross. For death to occur this quickly the legs must be broken causing the victim to asphyxiate. Jesus never had his legs broken. No, Jesus “died” immediatly after drinking from a sponge filled with “vinegar”. Now, medicine in those days wasn’t nearly as advanced as it is today, but they knew about the anesthetic qualities of plants such as opium poppies and belladonna. Can you think of a better way to raise your savior from the dead than knocking him out and having him wake up again? Nicodemus brought 75 lbs of aloes and myrrh to Jesus’s tomb. What was this for? It wasn’t for embalming, Jewish tradition forbids embalming. Aloe is one of the best natural treatments to heal wounds. Why would you want to heal a dead body?
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#29.6 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 6:15 PM EDT

MLIL

But Jesus didn’t follow Jewish tradition. He worked on the Sabbath and constantly shot down the teachings of the Scribes and Pharisees. These people thought of Jesus as a king, and what better way to honor a beloved, murdered king than to clean and treat his wounds, and yes, embalm him? Also, there’s no mention of how long after drinking the vinegar he died. The vinegar was given to Jesus to drink by the soldiers that crucified him, to mock his thirst, not by his followers. And, to make sure he was dead, the soldiers who broke the legs of the two thieves crucified next to Jesus, when they saw that he wasn’t moving, put a spear through his side, so if he was faking he wouldn’t live. Even if he was just unconcious, a stab wound to the side, even a fairly shallow one (which I’m sure this one wasn’t) would most likely have punctured any number of vital organs, and he would have either bled out or died of sepsis during the three days he was in the tomb.
Nice theories, but they don’t really work out, now do they?
That said, I don’t think that Jesus or God would ever have a problem with Yoga, if anything Jesus taught tolerance.
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#29.7 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 6:31 PM EDT

XNihil0Zer0

That the best you’ve got? Longinus the centurion who supervised the crucifixion of Jesus became a bishop in the early church according to the Acta Pilati. What a sweet deal, I wonder how he worked that one out? The original Greek word for the thrust by the soldier is nyssein. That word does not suggest a forceful thrust. The word means a light scratch, or a light puncture of the skin. It was a test for a reaction, not to ensure death. One of the best natural ways to prevent sepsis in a superficial wound is to treat it with aloe. Myrrh is also antiinflamitory and antiseptic. The soldiers did not give Jesus the vinegar people from the crowd around him did.
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#29.8 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 7:09 PM EDT

XNihil0Zer0

John 19:40 “They took the body of Jesus and wrapped it in linen cloths along with spices, according to the burial custom of the Jews.”
The burial customs of the Jews have not changed in 3500 years. The body is not to be touched except by giving it a ritual bath called a tahara, standing for purity and then the body is put in the ground in the quickest most simple fashion available with only traditional burial shrouds.
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#29.9 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 7:28 PM EDT

Uthaclena
XNihil0Zer0:
The points that you are arguing seem very reminiscent of the 1965 book “The Passover Plot” by Hugh Schonfield.
That being said, there really seems to be little actual evidence one way or the other after two thousand years.
Some of the apocryphal suggestions that Jesus traveled into India and studied mystic traditions there are found in the 1908 book “The Aquarian Gospel of Jesus the Christ” Again, rather thin on evidence, I am afraid.
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#29.10 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 7:31 PM EDT

XNihil0Zer0
That’s why arguments like this are so fun. With so little credible evidence on either side, I can match BS point for point. Watch:

Jesus is buried is a tomb called Rauzabal in the city of Srinagar. Local tradition states that the entombed was a prophet of Ahle-Kitab, or People of the Book, and his name was Isa – the Quranic name for Jesus. The prophet Yuz Asaf came to Kashmir from the West (Holy Land) in the reign of Raja Gopdatta (c 1st century A.D) according to the ancient official documents held by the current custodian of the tomb.
One book, Bhavishya Maha Purana (written in Sanskrit) contains an account of a king of India, Salivahana meeting “Isa-Masiha” (Jesus the Messiah)- a religious personage of fair complexion who was a foreigner.
“The king asked the holy man who he was. The other replied: ‘I am called a son of God, born of a virgin, minister of the non-believers, relentless in search of the truth.”
“..and I was called Isa-Masiha”
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#29.11 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 7:59 PM EDT

Uthaclena
XNihil0Zer0:
That’s why arguments like this are so fun. With so little credible evidence on either side, I can match BS point for point.
That’s fine, but would you do us the favor or either referring to the source or providing a link? I find arguing to be much more stimulating if there is a reference. You never know where that will lead later!
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#29.12 – Sat Oct 4, 2008 11:37 PM EDT
http://xoxchi.newsvine.com/_news/2008/10/03/1950880-yoga-at-school-causes-stress-among-some

Note. For more detail on the subject, please view my following posts:

Value of myrrh and aloe brought by Nicodemus

 https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2013/06/10/value-of-myrrh-and-aloe-brought-by-nicodemus-2/

https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2013/06/10/value-of-myrrh-and-aloe-brought-by-nicodemus/


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