Archive for the ‘Protestants’ Category

Discrepancy in number of books in the Bible: Jews, Catholics and Protestants

April 24, 2013

Hank Kimball Says:
April 23, 2013 at 10:41 pm

Either all scripture is inspired of God, or it is not. The bible I read has 66 books penned by 38 men directed by God in every word. Either what is said in it can be interpreted by what is said in it, or it cannot. If one scripture seems, on the surface to contradict another, further study and understanding is indicated. If we do not use scripture to interpret scripture, we have relied on our own understanding. That is precisely why so many religions exist today.

Paarsurrey says:

Since we are not in a debate; we are only trying to understand one another’s point of view. You have your own free will to have a blind-faith. I will opt to have my own free will of not having a blind faith.

I don’t agree with your above mentioned generalizations. Bible does not consist of the original Word of the one true God revealed on a truthful messenger prophet. It could have certain portions or sentences of revelations from the one true God but only translated from some other language; not in the original language they were revealed on a messenger prophet of God.

The difference in number of books of Catholics, Protestants, other Christian denomination and Jews is an evidence that Bible has been changed by the denominations they pertain to.

Jews– they have total 49 books in the OT Bible. They don’t believe in NT.

Catholics– they have 46 books in their OT+27 books in the NT; that makes their total book as 73.

Protestants- they have 39 books in their OT+27 books in the NT; that make their total of 66 books.

So by this I can tell you that you are a protestant.

If we go by the arguments given by you; the Christian-Catholics and Christian-Protestants both of them, under the warning mentioned in the end of book of revelation which you quoted in one of your earlier posts, are responsible for reducing the whole books from the Bible; the Catholics for 3 books and Protestant for 10 books.

We have not yet taken account of numerous passages and/or sentences which have been added to or reduced from the Bible by the Catholics and Protestants.

This proves that the warning of revelation or the preservation of the text of scriptures is only valid for the book of revelation and it cannot be extended or generalized to other books or the Bible as a whole.

Mormons and JWs consider “Catholics and Protestant” as heretics. Are they?

April 8, 2010

https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2010/02/07/jesus-was-not-dead-on-the-cross-in-the-first-place/#comment-983#comment-983

wudjab Says:

April 7, 2010 at 9:07 pm

You need to try harder Paar,

According to your own Quran :

[4:157] And for claiming that they killed the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the messenger of GOD. In fact, they never killed him, they never crucified him – they were made to think that they did. All factions who are disputing in this matter are full of doubt concerning this issue. They possess no knowledge; they only conjecture. For certain, they never killed him.*
and the reason they did not break his legs ?

John 19:36

These things happened so that the scripture would be fulfilled: “Not one of his bones will be broken,”
Now if you spent as much time learning about the real Islam (ahmediya’s are not considered Muslims after all) as you do trying to discredit Christianity, you might be better served.

paarsurrey Says:

April 8, 2010 at 10:29 am

Hi friend wudjab

Well my friend; “Mormons” and “JWs”- the only true Christians, do consider the Catholics and Protestants as heretics. Are you a Mormon or a JW? Please mention so that we may proceed further in the discussion.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

One expresses and declares one’s religion oneself; not others for one

April 8, 2010

https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2010/03/20/ending-the-pretense-of-faith/#comment-981#comment-981#comment-981

wudjab Says:

April 7, 2010 at 8:34 pm

Sorry to break it to you bud, but.

First of all as an Ahmediya, you are not even considered a muslim. So saying you are a “Ahmadi peaceful Muslim” is a bit of an oxymoron. I guess you missed the part about big Mo being the last prophet.

Also since you are weak on Islamic theology, I’d suggest you quit trying to pass judgement on Christianity. It just makes you look stupider than you are.. or maybe you really are that stupid.

Finally there is no such thing as a ‘peaceful muslim’. Muslims are peaceful only until they are forced to be.

paarsurrey Says:

April 7, 2010 at 11:37 pm

Hi friend wudjab

Thanks for your “kind” words.

Was Jesus a “Christian”; I think he was a Jew. “Christianity” started with clever Paul, when he (Paul) saw no vision and made up the story that he had seen. Paul founded the Religion “Christianity” and named it cleverly after Jesus.

It is better for you to name yourself a “Paulist” rather than to say that you are Christian; though I don’t mind if you still say that you are a Christian. One expresses and declares one’s religion oneself; not others.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks again

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

“Doubt, truth and wonder in ministry “

March 20, 2010

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/panelists/john_mark_reynolds/2010/03/doubt_truth_and_wonder_in_ministry.html

Hi friends

The above article mentions:

“Recently a study showed that many ministers don’t believe what they preach.They claim to know what they preach is wrong, but go on preaching it.”

One may think: Can a blind man show path to a blind man? If the pastors don’t know; how could they teach others to know?

It is so simple to understand.

God Almighty has indicated three types of knowledge:

1. Knowledge by certainty of reason,
2. Knowledge by certainty of sight,
3. Knowledge by certainty of experience.

This may be illustrated thus:

When a person perceives smoke from a distance his mind conceives that smoke and fire are inseparable, and therefore where there is smoke there must be fire also. This would be knowledge by the certainty of reason.

Then on a nearer approach he sees the flames of the fire and that is knowledge by the certainty of sight.

If one enters into the fire that would be knowledge by the certainty of experience.

Jesus had himself entered into the fire of knowledge of God that is he received Word of Revelation from the creator- God Allah YHWH Parmatma AhuraMazda.

Paul spoiled all the truthful teachings of Jesus based on Jesus’ experience mentioned above. Paul never spent any time learning from Jesus; so he had no knowledge of certainty. Paul was not even on the first stage of knowledge.

What Paul made up himself; it is enough that “Christians” have been following it blindly till now; but in the present era Paul and the Church have miserably failed.

The secular knowledge has uprooted the myth of Paul’s Theology invented by him at Rome. People don’t speak up and remain silent; but inwardly they have become Atheists and Agnostics.

Christian believers could only maintain their belief if they follow Jesus and Mary and don’t follow Paul and the mythical Church. Only Jesus and Mary could salvage their belief. The Atheists Agnostics are cognizant of the situation prevailing; and hence flexing their muscles to create wedge between the believers and Jesus- one of the perfect men that have been born on this planet Earth.

It is very appropriate time that the believers join in to reform Christianity and set it on to the path based on Teachings of Jesus and Mary and get rid of Paul and the Church to salvage Christians from the attack of Atheists Agnostics based only on doubt. They themselves name it “Skepticism” or path of doubt or devolution.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

False Prophets are always killed in terms of Torah

January 31, 2010

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=4657&p=93401#p93401

manfred wrote:

But the prophet, who being corrupted with pride, shall speak in my name things that I did not command him to say, or in the name of strange gods, shall be slain. Deuteronomy 18:20

This verse of the Torah tells us that false prophets should be killed. It is an instruction, not an explanation on how to recognize false prophets.

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friends

It is not an optional thing; it is a commandment that must be followed.Please read Deuteronomy again; it is a must .
The false Prophets have always been killed, otherwise the verse becomes meaningless. It is for this that we maintain that Jesus was not killed on the Cross; the Creator-God Allah YHWH planned things in such a way that Jesus survived against all odds; and finally he made good his escape to India.

Or

Please quote the verses from the Torah and the reason from Torah verses where explanation has been provided to recognize false prophets from the truthful ones; you won’t find any, in my opinion, except the one I have already mentioned that false Prophets are killed.

Catholics Protestants to take it seriously; no derision or ridiculing like the un-natural Atheists Agnostics, please.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

Jesus warned about Paul a false Prophet

January 30, 2010

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=2652&start=160

Trojan wrote: if you think the whole of the NT is Paul’s invention, then what right do you have to quote Jesus’ warning from it?

Paarsurrey wrote:

Hi friend Trojan

The cunning people like Paul was; they put things of their benefit in the already prevalent writings. This is what Paul and the Church did; they adopted already existing anonymous writings and changed them to serve their purpose. It is not difficult to ascertain Jesus’ true teachings from the wrongs changed by Paul and the Church.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad- the truthful Promised Messiah, Second Coming of Jesus

January 30, 2010

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=4657&p=93270#p93270

Paarsurrey wrote:

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad 1835-1908 was a truthful Prophet Messenger of the Creator – God Allah YHWH in terms of the Bible (OT as well as NT).

Please read the following verses carefully:

1. 20 But the prophet, who being corrupted with pride, shall speak in my name things that I did not command him to say, or in the name of strange gods, shall be slain. Deuteronomy 18:20
2. 14 And the Lord said to me: The prophets prophesy falsely in my name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, nor have I spoken to them: they prophesy unto you a lying vision, and divination and deceit, and the seduction of their own heart. 15 Therefore thus saith the Lord concerning the prophets that prophecy in my name, whom I did not send, that say: Sword and famine shall not be in this land: By sword and famine shall those prophets be consumed.
16 And the people to whom they prophecy, shall be cast out in the streets of Jerusalem because of the famine and the sword, and there shall be none to bury them: they and their wives, their sons and their daughters, and I will pour out their wickedness upon them. Jeremias 14:14-20
3. 36 For before these days rose up Theodas, affirming himself to be somebody, to whom a number of men, about four hundred, joined themselves: who was slain; and all that believed him were scattered, and brought to nothing. 37 After this man, rose up Judas of Galilee, in the days of the enrolling, and drew away the people after him: he also perished; and all, even as many as consented to him, were dispersed. Acts Of Apostles 5:36-37

The above topic that the false Prophets do get killed is firm principle confirmed by the Bible; I have only given some verses for your perusal.

Not only that Theodas and Judas of Galilee were got killed but Paul a counterfeit Epistle of Jesus and Joseph Smith Junior also got killed.

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was the truthful Prophet of the Creator- God Allah YHWH; he did not get killed.

The Catholics Protestants if they believe in Bible; they should accept Mirza Ghulam Ahmad as a truthful Prophet; no compulsion though.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

Catholics Protestants to note:it is a shame for a woman to speak in the church

January 30, 2010

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=4997&start=60

Paarsurrey wrote:

Hi my Catholic Protestant friends

I think the church going Catholics Protestants don’t read the Bible; the man-made NTBible, as I see many women there, and even singing the hymns in total disregard of the teachings of the Church.

1 Corinthians 14:

34 Let women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted them to speak, but to be subject, as also the law saith. 35 But if they would learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is a shame for a woman to speak in the church.

http://www.drbo.org/chapter/53014.htm

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

Jesus never died a cursed death on Cross; he survived

January 30, 2010

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=4701&p=93256#p93256

Brendalee wrote:

Please point me to the contemporary documents from Jesus’ time, that tell the story of Jesus going off to India so I may read it for myself

I love Isa and Miriam as mentioned in Bible

Paarsurrey says:

Hi friend Brendalee

Please read the book “Jesus in India” written by the Second Coming, the Promised Messiah 1835-1908 by accessing Ahmadiyya Official Website> library> books> Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. It is available online; please google for it.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks

Peter was not a rock to build a church upon

January 29, 2010

http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=4657&p=92983#p92983

A Christian says:

Upon this rock (Peter’s faith) I will build my church, and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it.

paarsurrey says:

Hi friends

I don’t think Jesus ever could have said such words for a person who denied him three times. Was this rock made of a mud which got cracked in the first available opportunity? Similarly no Church was erected by Jesus. Please tell us if the first Church was built before the event of Crucifixion or after when Jesus made good his escape to India.

This also seems to be Paul’s clever doing:

1. How many of the twelve did Paul meet? He did not meet them.
2. Peter was only eulogized by Paul for a purpose; to gain a little credence, which was not there.
Peter was not a rock to build a church upon. He was among the first who defected from Jesus and melted like anything; he was not loyal to Jesus. Paul chose him as a natural collaborator, in my opinion.
3. Paul did trade the concepts of Jesus, with mythical creeds of the pagans, all in Jesus’ name.
4. Paul did not meet Mary- the Mother, not even once. If Jesus had disappeared from Galilee, Paul did not meet Mary at least she would be there.

In my opinion, Paul must have smelled that Jesus, Mary and all of the loyal disciples of Jesus were missing from Judea; they were heading towards India.

Paul an enemy of Jesus and his friends changed his strategy. He used Jesus’ name and invented a creed which had nothing to do with Jesus. Paul invented a theological philosophy using Jesus as a scapegoat – which was based on “Jesus dying a cursed death on the Cross”, a mythological faith.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks