Jesus is no savior of Christians: if he couldn’t save himself death on Cross

Bob Carabbio , a Protestant, says :

“Jesus survived a cursed death on Cross in my opinion.”

But if He DID NOT die, then we Christians are MOST miserable for believing that we have a Savior – which we really don’t have at all.

And those that have died have perished in their sin and are lost forever.

Paarsurrey says:

Hi

AllahYHWH is the only savior; Jesus could not save himself from a death on the Cross; he was saved by AllahYHWH to whom he prayed in the Garden most fervently. One who could not save himself cannot be your savior, in my opinion.
Didn’t he pray to be saved? If he prayed; to whom he prayed? Did he pray to himself? No; it would be a folly if one prays to ones own self. Who was Jesus’ father or Abba to whom he prayed? It was none else, than AllahYHWH. One who could not save himself, in my opinion; how could he save you?

Why not to pray to AllahYHWH directly who saved Jesus a cursed death on Cross and then provided him and his mother a safe resting place in Kashmir, in India. Kashmir is a land of high altitude with fountains. Jesus died in India and is buried there as per Quran and the history of Kashmir.

Allah is most loving. You are not responsible for the mistakes of your ancestors. You have a chance for undoing the mistake; better avail it, in my opinion.

In Islam there are no hereditary sins.

I respect your religion; but this is what I sincerely believe; no compulsion on others.

I love Jesus and John the Baptist; both born naturally and normally of their mothers; they both were equally Word of God, and of course Adam might be a Word of God also. This is what is described to be Word became flesh; all three persons mentioned above were Words became flesh, in my opinion.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

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8 Responses to “Jesus is no savior of Christians: if he couldn’t save himself death on Cross”

  1. Doulos Says:

    *chuckle*

    The problem is that you do not understand what it is that Christians believe about Christ.

    We believe that Jesus Christ had two natures, unmingled, within one body. This means that Christ had both a fully human nature, given to him through his birth from Mary, and a fully divine nature since he is the pre-existent and eternal Logos.

    No, Christ did not pray in the Garden to be ‘saved,’ what he prayed for was if it was the Father’s will, that his fate would not come to pass. This was his human side crying out all humans do. Being God though, he knew that “the cup” could not pass from him and that he had to be crucified in order to save humanity.

    Your question seems to be, “How could he save us by dying?” The answer is that he had already ‘saved’ us from sin merely by becoming Incarnate. What he saved us from through the cross was death. Whe Christ died both of his natures, human and divine decended into Hades. But the divine cannot die! Because of this, because of the mere presence of the divine in the underworld, that power of death was shattered. It no longer has any power over Christians.

    By becoming incarnate Christ re-sanctified material creation and made it possible to once again achieve the state of existance that humanity was in before the Fall. By dying on the cross–and most importantly by ressurrecting afterwards–Christ destroyed the effects of original sin, which ultimatley was death.

    That is Jesus is a savor of Christians. Before you decide that everything we have believed for 2,000 years is a lie, please try to actually understand what it is that you are talking about. This salvation has absolutely nothing to do with “hereditary sins.”

    Ignorance about a topic is way to automatically prove that your conclusions are wrong.

  2. yourbrotherinchrist Says:

    It is a myth that the religion of Islam respects Jesus Christ. Islam does not recognize Jesus Christ as the only begotten Son of God that came to this planet to save us from the death that our sins had earned us. No matter how many polite things one might say about Jesus Christ, if they do not recognize Him as the Son of God, then they are rejecting Him. The Father and the Son are equal. If you reject the Son, then you reject the Father that sent Him.

    I pray sincerely that the Lord will open your heart and your mind to the Truth.

  3. paarsurrey Says:

    Hi friend Doulos

    Quote :We believe that Jesus Christ had two natures, unmingled, within one body.Unquote

    Kindly quote from Gospels clearly that Jesus had two natures within one body.

    Two natures means two bodies; this is what makes Catholics and Protestants irrational and illogical.

    If your belief is wrong; you can always correct it. Make it what Jesus and John the Baptis believed.

    I love real Jesus and Mary of Quran not the mythical ones of Paul and his Church.

    Thanks

  4. paarsurrey Says:

    Hi friend yourbrotherinchrist ,

    I think that is your blind faith. Jesus was a Jews and he got baptised with John the Baptist to show that he believed the Jewish creeds. Jesus was neither god nor son of God.

    Let Jesus be a perfect man only; and god he never was.

    I love real Jesus and Mary of Quran not the mythical ones of Paul and his Church.

    Thanks

  5. thehiddenfriend Says:

    Paarsurrey,
    Thank you so much for sharing what you believe in.
    If you don’t mind, I would like to share with you what I believe also.
    So you say that Jesus was a great teacher a example, correct? That is all He is to you, right? Then tell me this: do you sin?
    If you answer no, then I suggest you think again. I sin, you sin, we all sin. Humans can not escape from it.
    John the Baptist also sinned, he couldn’t escape from it but he was still a great teacher and example (you admitted to that yourself) but Jesus NEVER sinned. Can you claim that for yourself?
    If you are truthful and admit that you sin, then what you need is a Savior, not an example. (D.M. Stearns)
    Jesus and God were Son and Father. They had never been apart and the only reason Jesus was talking to His father that night was probably because He missed His father. Plus, He was in the body of a human so He had to suffer the same fear that a human would.
    Can you tell me that you would NOT be scared to know that you were about to be killed? You knew the pain you were going to experience before you even experienced it. Jesus was in the same situation.
    He knew and was expecting the pain and since He was in a human’s body He knew only fear in that moment BUT that doesn’t mean He also knew what would happen afterwards, that He would go down to the gates of Hades to retrieve the key to YOUR freedom and come back up to prove YOU wrong.
    Do not doubt His love. Do not doubt that you need a Savior, not only a great teacher and example. You can not save yourself but He was able to save Himself, otherwise why is there an empty tomb?
    I don’t want to seem to be bashing you over the head, I’m not. I am only sharing with you, my own believes. I wanted to bring what I believe into clear view and then agree to disagree. So thank you my friend, for listening.
    TheHiddenFriend

    • paarsurrey Says:

      Hi friend thehiddenfriend

      I thank you for writing comments on my blog. Please help your Christian friend sch to whom I have sent following post:

      https://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/2010/01/22/punishment-for-claimants-of-divinity-in-jews-from-moses/#comment-895#comment-895

      paarsurrey Says:
      January 28, 2010 at 2:43 pm | Reply edit
      Hi friend sch
      Now see my friend; how many prophecies of Jesus you have mentioned in your post (which I have described as ocean of words); I have counted them to be 25 in number, if not more. So that makes Jesus a good Prophet Messenger of Creator-God Allah YHWH and that is all.
      It proves that Jesus was not a god. Had Jesus been a god; then you would have mentioned things created by Jesus? Jesus did not create anything; everything was as before him.
      If you want to prove Jesus to be a creator-god; mention things he created; Jesus did not create anything. Please mention as many things created by Jesus at least 25 of them like Sun, Moon and Earth; not even one of these.
      The sign- the biggest one of Jesus, was that of Jonah- the Prophet; not of any god or of the Creator.
      I think, now you understand and agree with me.
      I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.
      Thanks

      • somethingcrazy Says:

        If you want to see that Jesus created, then just check out the first verses of John’s gospel:

        “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning.

        “Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it.

        “There came a man who was sent from God; his name was John. He came as a witness to testify concerning that light, so that through him all men might believe. He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light. The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world.

        “He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognise him. He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. Yet to all who received him, to all who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God – children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

        “The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.”

        (John 1 v1-14)

        These verses clearly state that Jesus (aka the Word) was there at the beginning of everything, and all things were created through Him – therefore including the sun, moon and earth which you mentioned. Everything. They also state that Jesus is God (the Word was God).

        As for the original post, you clearly misunderstand what was going on at the cross – Jesus HAD to die in order to save us. If he hadn’t become the perfect, everlasting sacrifice for our sins then we couldn’t have been forgiven, as sin would have gone unpunished (and as God is perfect, He is perfectly just and must punish sin). It would be far more accurate to say that “Jesus would be no Saviour of Christians if He DID save himself from death on the cross”.

  6. paarsurrey Says:

    Hi friend somethingcrazy

    I thank you for participating in the discussion.

    Please go through the passages quoted by you again. I don’t see Jesus’ name mentioned in them; if I have missed please underline Jesus’ name in them.

    I think it is only a guess of the Catholics Protestants that Jesus’ name has been literally mentioned there; maybe it is just another phenomenon, which John, only a human being wrongly took up like that; nevertheless it is not binding on others to subscribe to John’s mistakes or his wrong views or concepts.

    I think it is a mistake of our Christian friends to make Jesus a god; like our Hindu friends have made Krishna a god, in my opinion.

    But for Paul; Jesus truthful followers would have never taken Jesus to be a god. Matthew, Marks and Luke did not mention that Word has become flesh.

    You might have spoken many words in your life. Did you ever see that any of your Word has become flesh? Your Word would have never even smelt like flesh. It is your tongue and lips and your throat made of flesh that help one to make words, and of course the teeth made of bones, which helps to make the words. The reverse phenomenon never happens, in my opinion.

    It is just a mistake of John, or those who wrote for John that they thought otherwise, in my opinion.

    Jesus never thought like this; how could he had claimed to be god when he knew that he literally created no new Sun, no new Moon and no new Earth. It is only an accusation of Catholics Protestants against Jesus that Jesus claimed to be literally god.

    Jesus could have asserted himself for his claims and reasons more clearly and in a straightforward manner. Whom Jesus as a god had to fear about? Jesus needed no self-appointed spokesmen like Paul or Church, in my opinion. Since Jesus was not god so he did not claim it unequivocally.

    I love Jesus for his wisdom. Jesus feared nobody except God Allah YHWH whose humble servant Jesus was, in my opinion.
    Thanks

    I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

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